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#1011877 - 12/09/2011 18:51 Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you!
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
This thread for anyone that lives on the coastline that is impacted or about to be affected by Industrial Development. A place to discuss pending proposals, community opinion and to share information!

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#1011880 - 12/09/2011 19:00 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Sara B]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
An information meeting is being held by Xstrata Coal to provide some engagement with community regarding the proposed Balaclava Island Coal terminal development. Tuesday 13th September 2011 6-8pm, Emu Park Cultural Hall (7-9 Hill street Emu Park).
Here is some background info from Xstrata Coal & CCC respectively.
If you are a local and have concerns, I urge you to come along!

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#1012939 - 18/09/2011 22:42 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Sara B]
bundybear Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 28/12/2010
Posts: 2366
Loc: Between Bundy and Gladstone
All I can say is God help the environment because the govt won't.

They have succeeded in killing the marine life in Gladstone harbour to the point now that people are being hospitalised from it. People who have contact with the water are sick. They were blaming the flood, that Gladstone never had.

I am told of a trawler owner/operator who is going to be paid 7 figures not to catch anything anywhere for the next 3 years. I think, please note the word think, it is the port paying him out.

We are south of Gladstone, beyond their closure, and fish caught on the reef here this weekend had lesions.

The same govt who has bought in laws that prevent us even putting a swale on our property to 'protect the reef' have poisoned the waters.

Being hung, drawn and quartered would be too good for them.

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#1013572 - 21/09/2011 12:57 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: bundybear]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
I had to walk out of that meeting... their rhetoric was making me physically ill! The worst part is knowing that these people (getting the approvals up, doing the ahem 'consultation' with community, researching the impacts to wildlife, fisheries, tourism)'know' exactly what it is that they are doing! I wonder if it was their region, a place that they were connected to - if they would care! I don't have any children but I feel so sad for the kids who will not know what it is like to look out and see dolphins, all they will see is coal tankers lining up to be filled by a dirty conveyer belt full of coal. I pity the future generations who will not know what it is to have a feed of fresh caught reef fish, who cannot just go catching muddies or even traverse in their vessels the places that the Gladstone Ports corporation will close (to allow coal tankers right of way). I feel so angry, so helpless and worst part is that most people in Emu Park (Terminal will be located 30km away in Fitzroy River delta - Balaclava Island) are seemingly unaware or too busy to care. I saw hardly any young people at the information meeting which dissapoints me.
anyways I went interstate for a while and the place I travelled through was 'lock the gate' country, it was encouraging to see that there is a movement, but how to coordinate ourselves so that the agenda's do not get waylaid by politics, that is always the challenge!


Edited by cltrax (21/09/2011 13:00)

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#1013574 - 21/09/2011 13:02 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Sara B]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
whoa - the fish in your area are also affected!!! Government & Mining Industry will downplay it, no doubt.

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#1013582 - 21/09/2011 14:17 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Sara B]
bundybear Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 28/12/2010
Posts: 2366
Loc: Between Bundy and Gladstone
My gate is locked grin Has been for a while

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#1013971 - 23/09/2011 18:42 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Sara B]
Loopy Radar Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 880
Loc: Lismore NSW
Originally Posted By: cltrax
I had to walk out of that meeting... their rhetoric was making me physically ill! The worst part is knowing that these people (getting the approvals up, doing the ahem 'consultation' with community, researching the impacts to wildlife, fisheries, tourism)'know' exactly what it is that they are doing! I wonder if it was their region, a place that they were connected to - if they would care! I don't have any children but I feel so sad for the kids who will not know what it is like to look out and see dolphins, all they will see is coal tankers lining up to be filled by a dirty conveyer belt full of coal. I pity the future generations who will not know what it is to have a feed of fresh caught reef fish, who cannot just go catching muddies or even traverse in their vessels the places that the Gladstone Ports corporation will close (to allow coal tankers right of way). I feel so angry, so helpless and worst part is that most people in Emu Park (Terminal will be located 30km away in Fitzroy River delta - Balaclava Island) are seemingly unaware or too busy to care. I saw hardly any young people at the information meeting which dissapoints me.
anyways I went interstate for a while and the place I travelled through was 'lock the gate' country, it was encouraging to see that there is a movement, but how to coordinate ourselves so that the agenda's do not get waylaid by politics, that is always the challenge!


There is only 2 parts to the agenda. Lock the gate, and keep it locked.
_________________________
It's going to be a great storm season... somewhere else!

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#1015764 - 29/09/2011 18:38 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Loopy Radar]
avalon Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/07/2007
Posts: 1547
Loc: Mt Macedon Vic 870m elev
Just reading this thread and wanted to say that i feel for you guys up there. It looks as if Coal is still King in Australia. As someone posted earlier, God help the environment because our Government has dollar signs for eyes and they could not give a rats about the reef, the residents or the wildlife.

They will let it happen on the QLD coast and The Liverpool Plains. There is talk of coal-seam-gas exploration near Bacchus Marsh here in Victoria, which is one of the vegetable and fruit growing areas near Melbourne.

Good luck to you all.


Edited by avalon (29/09/2011 18:38)

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#1015769 - 29/09/2011 18:45 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: avalon]
Petros Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 30/12/2002
Posts: 8071
Loc: Maffra, Central Gippsland, Vi...
Why would Australia Govt allow another coal port to open thus export more coal, allowing even more coal to be burnt in the world when its spending $$$$ of OUR money to shut down coal fired power stations in Aust to reduce CO2 emmissions!!

Dosent this proposed coal port go against the very fundamental CO2 reduction policy that Julia is implementing - despite telling us she wouldnt???

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#1015931 - 30/09/2011 10:21 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Petros]
Loopy Radar Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 880
Loc: Lismore NSW
Why? Do you really believe in anything they spout publicly? It's all rhetoric and spin. And the population has been dumbed down so much so that they can lie like they do before every election, and get away with it. Well, I think the tide is turning against them now. The Many people are waking up to the game. It's all in plain view now. With the internet, the ballgame is changing, and the circle squeezing ever smaller.
_________________________
It's going to be a great storm season... somewhere else!

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#1016463 - 01/10/2011 21:09 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Loopy Radar]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan

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#1017949 - 08/10/2011 12:18 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Petros]
Tempest Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 17/11/2001
Posts: 3633
Originally Posted By: Petros
Why would Australia Govt allow another coal port to open thus export more coal, allowing even more coal to be burnt in the world when its spending $$$$ of OUR money to shut down coal fired power stations in Aust to reduce CO2 emmissions!!

Dosent this proposed coal port go against the very fundamental CO2 reduction policy that Julia is implementing - despite telling us she wouldnt???


Plain and simple , the govt is banking on the resource sector to get thier budget back into the black through mining and carbon taxes.

The biggest polluter is emssion from vehicles, no mention of that from the govt, they receive billions of $$ through fuel taxes.

The mining sector is keeping Aust out of recession and keeping a lot of people emplyed, thats reality.


Edited by Tempest (08/10/2011 12:18)

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#1018182 - 09/10/2011 08:42 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Tempest]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
But that does not justify environmental vandalism. Degradation of environment is not acceptable collatoral damage.
In the process of keeping the economy afloat (in the short term):
They (we) are discharging mine wastewater directly into our water supply,
They are redirecting rivers and streams which contributes to flooding impacts, decline in water quality, sediment erosion & transport, destruction of habitat values and loss of biodiversity.
They are destroying underground aquifer systems and contributing to decline in water quality, loss of groundwater dependent ecosystems and loss of valued ecosystem services.
They are destroying high quality agricultural land - once lost - lost forever. Try and eat that!
They are destroying coastal and marine environments - decline in water quality, pollution, destruction of habitat - diminishing ecological integrity and in turn decline in fisheries productivity & contributing to loss of biodiversity not to forget the impact on Tourism assets.
This is now playing out in a big way at the localised, regional and national level. There is no long-term plan to conserve our environment - nowhere is safe or is valued highly enough. Remember too that your health and wellbeing depends upon continued functioning of the environment (healthy, air, water & soil) along with all the other ecosystem services that you and many Australians are taking for granted.
Mining is now a liability in so much as it is our 'failsafe' mechanism to stave off the recession. One day it will fall arse up and what will we have then? A degraded landscape that can no longer feed us/ support our consumptive needs.
I don't think that we should consider economic prosperity in isolation from environmental impacts or have such short-term scope. I believe that we must consider carefully what it is that we are doing now and how this will affect our prosperity into the future, if not consider carefully how our actions will affect our survival as a nation, if not global human population! Economic prosperity does not sit at the top of my triangle - the Environment does because upon it - I depend!

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#1018183 - 09/10/2011 08:44 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Sara B]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
I always thought the plan was to diversify... we should be developing other industries, alternative economies (i.e. manufacturing) so that when the time comes we can affect a transition out of mining. Mining is not, will not be forever - because nothing ever is forever!


Edited by chunkyluxtrax (09/10/2011 08:45)

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#1018200 - 09/10/2011 10:34 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Sara B]
Loopy Radar Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 880
Loc: Lismore NSW
Originally Posted By: chunkyluxtrax
But that does not justify environmental vandalism. Degradation of environment is not acceptable collatoral damage.
In the process of keeping the economy afloat (in the short term):
They (we) are discharging mine wastewater directly into our water supply,
They are redirecting rivers and streams which contributes to flooding impacts, decline in water quality, sediment erosion & transport, destruction of habitat values and loss of biodiversity.
They are destroying underground aquifer systems and contributing to decline in water quality, loss of groundwater dependent ecosystems and loss of valued ecosystem services.
They are destroying high quality agricultural land - once lost - lost forever. Try and eat that!
They are destroying coastal and marine environments - decline in water quality, pollution, destruction of habitat - diminishing ecological integrity and in turn decline in fisheries productivity & contributing to loss of biodiversity not to forget the impact on Tourism assets.
This is now playing out in a big way at the localised, regional and national level. There is no long-term plan to conserve our environment - nowhere is safe or is valued highly enough. Remember too that your health and wellbeing depends upon continued functioning of the environment (healthy, air, water & soil) along with all the other ecosystem services that you and many Australians are taking for granted.
Mining is now a liability in so much as it is our 'failsafe' mechanism to stave off the recession. One day it will fall arse up and what will we have then? A degraded landscape that can no longer feed us/ support our consumptive needs.
I don't think that we should consider economic prosperity in isolation from environmental impacts or have such short-term scope. I believe that we must consider carefully what it is that we are doing now and how this will affect our prosperity into the future, if not consider carefully how our actions will affect our survival as a nation, if not global human population! Economic prosperity does not sit at the top of my triangle - the Environment does because upon it - I depend!


Unfortunately most people believe that we are an enlightened breed, somehow smarter than all previous generations, and that our technological advances is proof of this, and that somehow this justifies our 'high standard' of living and makes it right.
_________________________
It's going to be a great storm season... somewhere else!

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#1018201 - 09/10/2011 10:38 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Loopy Radar]
Loopy Radar Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 880
Loc: Lismore NSW
_________________________
It's going to be a great storm season... somewhere else!

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#1018311 - 09/10/2011 21:40 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Tempest]
mumso Offline
Cloud Gazer

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 10
Loc: Taree, NSW
Unfortunately, it is a mistake to believe that the mining industry employs a lot of people in Australia. It does not. There is an excellent report called "Mining the Truth" which was produced by the Australia Institute and published about a month ago. The report states that the "mining sector accounts for 217,000 jobs - less than 2% of total employment." Apparently the mining industry takes credit for 'upstream' and 'downstream' jobs such as employment in the construction and cafe industries. Quote: "If every industry tried to claim credit for all the upstream and downstream jobs in other industries then, collectively, Australian industries would be taking credit for over 30 million jobs." The Australian workforce is only around 11 million people.

It is hightime that the Australian people stood up to be counted. There are too many people who think that Australia is one big quarry.

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#1019038 - 12/10/2011 18:14 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: mumso]
davidg Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 01/06/2008
Posts: 2248
Loc: Glenbrook/Penrith
The mining industry might "directly" employ 217,000 people but the flow on effect is real. I work in an industry that doesn't soley rely on mining, but without large contracts from BHP, Pilbara Iron, FMG and QR there would be plenty of people out of a job in my workplace. I dont recall helping the Australia Institue conduct their study, nor do any of our suppliers that rely heavily on us. Sounds like a load of left wing "think tank" paper shuffling BS to me.

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#1019503 - 13/10/2011 19:36 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: davidg]
Loopy Radar Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 880
Loc: Lismore NSW
Originally Posted By: davidg
The mining industry might "directly" employ 217,000 people but the flow on effect is real. I work in an industry that doesn't soley rely on mining, but without large contracts from BHP, Pilbara Iron, FMG and QR there would be plenty of people out of a job in my workplace. I dont recall helping the Australia Institue conduct their study, nor do any of our suppliers that rely heavily on us. Sounds like a load of left wing "think tank" paper shuffling BS to me.


It's the whole left/right paradigm that's BS. Every issue gets co-opted by it.
I see clearly the conundrum we are in. We have become addicted to cheap oil. And corporate and political corruption has resulted in an awful bloody mess that will take many generations to clean up.
But there are problems that make even the oil problem shrink in comparison. How many "Fukushimas" will it take to completely screw life on earth. We have a humungous challenge at hand. Actually, words cannot express the peril we are in.
Sure there are some that lean to the extreme, but the reality is, most people are moderate. Are most of your friends moderate? Ask 100 people that, and I am pretty sure that 99 of them will have moderate friends. And sure, many get carried away by left or right leaning towers of distraction, spin, and downright lies and deception, but most, if given a chance, and enough information on the table, will inevitably take a moderate path.
Lefty bashing etc, will only perpetuate the ages old game of divide and rule. It's the oldest system of control, so no wonder it's the predominant paradigm today also.
_________________________
It's going to be a great storm season... somewhere else!

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#1019771 - 14/10/2011 08:32 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Loopy Radar]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
A meeting organised by KAFDA to be held at the Yeppoon Town Hall, 18 October 2011. This is a chance for the locals & others living in & around Capricornia to learn about what is being proposed and consider the implications & impacts of any industrial development in the Fitzroy River Delta, Keppel Bay, Capricorn Coast. Think Community, Think Environment, Think Sustainable Healthy Future!

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#1102703 - 04/05/2012 14:12 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Sara B]
FNQ Bunyip Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 31/12/2004
Posts: 1506
Loc: North bank river Daintree
Well you voted for him , so don't start crying now ..

Newman screws Gladstone Harbor

I think this will just be the beginning of huge environmental damage under the LNP ..
_________________________
2017 3892mm
2018 5191mm
2019 Rainfall


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#1103064 - 07/05/2012 15:54 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: FNQ Bunyip]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
I didn't vote for him... thats for sure!
Voting does a fat lot of good for nothing, just so dissappointing....

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#1104460 - 17/05/2012 05:48 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: Sara B]
LQQKN Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 24/08/2007
Posts: 1438
Loc: , tweed coast
Im not a violant person tho im willing to go into one of those csg places and punch out some of the people in there or even better grinades its obvious 100percent of the comunity is againsd this tho our government couldnt care less this is a world heretege area and they dont respect current an future australians is just good for overseas places but not really becouse its causing pollution while everyones tryin to cut down on polluting I hope these deamons get whats comin for them


Edited by LQQKN (17/05/2012 05:49)

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#1104910 - 20/05/2012 11:27 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: LQQKN]
FNQ Bunyip Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 31/12/2004
Posts: 1506
Loc: North bank river Daintree
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/cargo-ship...u-1226360919052

how long before the next one to hit the reef and cause huge environmental damage ??
_________________________
2017 3892mm
2018 5191mm
2019 Rainfall


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#1104953 - 20/05/2012 18:24 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: FNQ Bunyip]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14286
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
There are on average 6000 ship transits on average per year so 1 breaking down isn't a bad average now is it?
See http://www.reef.crc.org.au/discover/people/facts_people.htm

The last one was in 2010 so on average that would be around 12000 transits in 2 years since the last problem. Hardly what I would call a massive increase in the rate of ships breaking down or encroaching on protected areas.

Oh and in case you forgot the big thing on the end of the chain is called an anchor and if they really really wanted to stop the ship drifting then it is quite a simple matter to wait until your in shallow wnough water for it to reach the bottom and stop it from drifting by dropping the anchor?

Whats that Skip, the anchor could also damage the reef? Guess your dammed if you do or dammed if you don't then Skip.

But without an engine they wouldn't have had the power to raise it again so thats probably why they didn't use it as they where in NO danger of hitting any reefs before the tug reached them. Just as well we have a couple of tugs located along teh coast to actually go out and do exactly what they did. I wonder why they are there anyway?

As to World Heritage Area what exactly are the benefits of having a name 99.9% of the population couldn't give a fruitbat pooh about? Oh it makes fleecing tourists easier because it is somehow special is that it? Meh.
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#1105016 - 21/05/2012 08:38 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: SBT]
FNQ Bunyip Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 31/12/2004
Posts: 1506
Loc: North bank river Daintree
SBT smile I know you like to play devils advocate on a lot of subjects, and quite often I agree with what you are saying..

1 in 6000 might not be a huge risk .
however a ship drifting around for 30 hours
is a very bad situation.

Imagine if it had hit and broken up . I don't care if its listed as world heritage or not we don't want tons of oil washing up on the beaches / reefs ..

the further north something like this happens the longer it will take to respond too.. So if it happened of the end of palm island , you could have 100's or even 1000's of people on hand to clean up , but if this happens north of cooktown it could take days to even get a few 100 people on the ground ..

Having the pacific responder based in cairns is a good start but as the shipping movements increase the risk increase. And they are increasing , some-days it feels like your stuck in traffic just trying to cross the shipping lane to get out to the reef ..

the anchor would not be powered by the main engine , a ship that size would have auxiliary engines for lights / hydraulics ect ..so it remains unclear as to what the reasons were too not drop it ..

I'm not against development outright but if we are going to do all this exporting we need to ensure that our backyard is protected from every possible risk no matter how small it might seem at the time.
Murphy go's to sea as well wink

cheers
_________________________
2017 3892mm
2018 5191mm
2019 Rainfall


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#1105029 - 21/05/2012 09:58 Re: Coal & CSG ports - coming to a beach near you! [Re: FNQ Bunyip]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14286
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
I was never going to hit a reef as it was in realively open water and that is the main reason why it didn't drop anchor. It also probably didn't because it would have caused more damage if it did and it pulled off.

Look the whole protect the reef is a great idea, but fair dinkum some people need to get a grip on reality starting with the reporters that put this news story out.

Did you see the coverage last night when a reporter stated at the end of the report that "the only thing stopping destruction of the reef was a fragile cable"?

Where do they get these people from? Fragile cable? The bloody thing is designed to drag 100's of 1000's of tons of ship not pull your wannabe AWD out of a soft spot on your front lawn. It is this very reporting slant where anything that might have a minute Green impact will get the shrillest coverage.

I find the lack of general knowledge of so called reporters and journalists frightening because they spread bullshit disguised as a news report and people believe them as facts. Did the reporter contact teh tug owner? Did they ask a simple question like "What size is the cable and can it do the job"?

No, instead they further beat up the story by stating the cable is fragile and could further endanger the tissue box reef which will be forever damnaged if a ship runs into it.

Heaven help us if they ever find out that the RAAF still uses part of the reef for target practice with real bombs, or that during WWII a US Submarine ran aground and the 190 tons of fuel oil was released after it too was bombed to stop it falling into Jap hands there by releasing that oil, or that oil exploration companies in the 1960s drilled hundreds of test holes looking for oil or the navy used to be tasked to keep navigation gaps in the reef open by using explosives destroy chunks of the reef to clear channels.

Your average cat 3 cyclone does more damage to the reef than any number of ships running into it.

Someone has to be a devils advocate because my world is going to hell in a hand basket one bullshit news story at a time.
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799mm Feb
130 March
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