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#1088737 - 14/03/2012 11:45 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: CeeBee]
Brett Guy Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 5158
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
How the hell can you start the sea leve height of all those different places at the global mean? How is that scientific. It just makes it look like everything startedat that one uniform hight and then went haywire from there. Dodgy as my friend.

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#1088748 - 14/03/2012 12:18 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Brett Guy]
ROM Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/01/2007
Posts: 6628
Relax guys.
CeeBee is following the old warmist pattern that is such a feature of most warmists who come onto a blog and run head long into a bunch of switched on skeptics.

There is no original contribution, just a lifting of warmist papers and articles repeated ad nauseum on the blog.
He is attracting attention to himself which makes him feel good.
He only posts what he thinks will stir the skeptics up.
He thinks it is funny watching the skeptics doing all the running around and knocking down the garbage he posts, most of which he would'nt normally bother about or maybe he can't even understand.

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#1088750 - 14/03/2012 12:24 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: CeeBee]
bd bucketingdown Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2008
Posts: 6033
Loc: Eastern A/Hills SA
BOM & CSRIO latest spiel, rain and cooling are misleading people, sun is down & china's particle count up, disrupting temp rises, but wait for 20 to 30 years and we will see the rises again, the future is bleak and horrible as usual, it is dire and we must act quick, yes, its doom they say.......no matter what you see outside the window and ouside the front door, and what you feel...it is all a mirage they say!...

"COOLER weather in Australia in the past two years due to the rain-inducing La Nina weather pattern does not undermine the collective evidence of climate change, the nation's peak scientific and weather organisations say.

In their second State of the Climate report released today, the CSIRO and Bureau of Meteorology say evidence shows global warming continued and human activities were mainly responsible.

The report says natural climate variability had affected the global mean temperature and sea levels during the past century but much less than greenhouse gases, which continued to rise.

"It is clear that increasing greenhouse gas concentrations will result in significant further global warming," the report says.

Uncertainties remained regarding future levels of greenhouse gas concentrations, and the timing and magnitude of changes, particularly at regional scales.

There were further uncertainties relating to tipping points in the climate system, such as the break-up of ice sheets, which could lead to rapid climate change, the report says. "Unless greenhouse gas emissions decrease, we expect to see the temperature of the atmosphere and the oceans continue to warm and sea levels continue to rise at current or even higher rates," the report says.
.
. .
Australian average temperatures were projected to rise by 1-5C by 2070 when compared with the climate of recent decades.

Bureau of Meteorology climate monitoring manager Karl Braganza said the scientific community found it difficult to communicate the climate change message because of the long timeframes involved.

"People want to see the things projected for the next 20 to 30 years happening now and if they don't see it, their acceptance of the science is ameliorated by that," Dr Braganza said.

"That is a hard thing to get around."

He said there were a number of factors that had made near-term warming forecasts difficult.

"We are probably at a period where solar forcing (the sun's energy) has been lower than recent decades," he said.

There was an influence from China's rapid economic development, which was causing more particles to be put into the atmosphere that reflect sunlight. "I think all of those things are affecting the climate system but the dominant, real standout influence is the increase in greenhouse gases, mostly CO2," Dr Braganza said......."

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national...f-1226298630461


Edited by bd bucketingdown (14/03/2012 12:26)

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#1088764 - 14/03/2012 13:06 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: bd bucketingdown]
Dustydevil Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 12/04/2010
Posts: 186
Loc: Darwin
I came across this interesting article about atmospheric CO2 levels. The researcher reckons that CO2 levels were as high millions of years ago as they are today. Couldn't be because of human activities could it? Perhaps natural variability? Despite all the other horrible and nasty things that went with it (higher sea level, no sea ice, very little ice in Greenland and higher temps); the Earth survived and all was well. How come Global Warming Alarmists see it differently?

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#1088767 - 14/03/2012 13:10 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: bd bucketingdown]
Arnost Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 10/02/2007
Posts: 3909
Quote:
How the hell can you start the sea leve height of all those different places at the global mean? How is that scientific. It just makes it look like everything startedat that one uniform hight and then went haywire from there. Dodgy as my friend.


I think that we have done the sea-level thing here as well:

Pacific Sea Levels

Australian Sea Levels

And note - both these posts were addressing DJ's sensationalist claims - where I caught him out cherrypicking data, and he did not answer either. And in fact the last post is at one of those times when DJ subsequently went balistic and discussion of Global Warming was temporarily banned on these forums... LOL.
_________________________
“No. Not even in the face of Armageddon. Never compromise” ...

And this of course applies to scientific principles. Never compromise these. Never! [Follow the science and you will be shown correct in the end...]

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#1088776 - 14/03/2012 13:31 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Arnost]
Arnost Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 10/02/2007
Posts: 3909
Quote:
came across this interesting article about atmospheric CO2 levels. The researcher reckons that CO2 levels were as high millions of years ago as they are today.


This is the canonical graph with temp from Scotese and CO2 from Berner GEOCARBIII



Otherwise - I like this info rich plot:


A comparative record of cosmic radiation, mean global temperature, atmospheric carbon dioxide, atmospheric oxygen, extinction rates, and variations in mean sea level.
_________________________
“No. Not even in the face of Armageddon. Never compromise” ...

And this of course applies to scientific principles. Never compromise these. Never! [Follow the science and you will be shown correct in the end...]

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#1088788 - 14/03/2012 13:46 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Dustydevil]
CeeBee Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 25/02/2012
Posts: 2649
Originally Posted By: Dustydevil
I came across this interesting article about atmospheric CO2 levels. The researcher reckons that CO2 levels were as high millions of years ago as they are today. Couldn't be because of human activities could it? Perhaps natural variability? Despite all the other horrible and nasty things that went with it (higher sea level, no sea ice, very little ice in Greenland and higher temps); the Earth survived and all was well. How come Global Warming Alarmists see it differently?


Stop and think for a second about how those high sea levels and higher temps will affect our modern civilisation. The Earth will still go on it's merry way as per usual but our modern way of life will change. We won't be the first civilisation to be affected by climate change but we are the first that can do something about it - reduce pumping C02 into the atmosphere for starters.



_________________________

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#1088792 - 14/03/2012 14:02 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: CeeBee]
bd bucketingdown Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2008
Posts: 6033
Loc: Eastern A/Hills SA
What high sea levels and what high temperatures...Looks much same on the shores of Australia, and temperatures are cooler for last 3 years or so!


Edited by bd bucketingdown (14/03/2012 14:04)

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#1088809 - 14/03/2012 14:26 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: bd bucketingdown]
pete28 Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 08/01/2007
Posts: 1164
Loc: Christchurch, New Zealand
According to the BOM though BD we are only getting cooler temperatures due to 2 consecutive La Nina events! Very convenient of them to say that as soon as we start getting cooler temps to blame it on la Nina, couldn't possibly be normal swings of temperature that the earth has been experiencing the past 200 million years could it! The BOM is certainly on the global warming band wagon, disgusting as they are supposed to be a neutral government agency, not influenced by politics!

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#1088857 - 14/03/2012 15:23 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: bd bucketingdown]
CeeBee Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 25/02/2012
Posts: 2649
Originally Posted By: bd bucketingdown
What high sea levels and what high temperatures...Looks much same on the shores of Australia, and temperatures are cooler for last 3 years or so!


Well, Dustydevil was reading how when C02 levels were high in the past, sea levels were high and so were temperatures.

High levels of the greenhouse gas C02 = higher temps and higher sea levels due to melting ice etc, which is exactly what is happening now.

_________________________

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#1088904 - 14/03/2012 16:00 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: CeeBee]
Dustydevil Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 12/04/2010
Posts: 186
Loc: Darwin
"High levels of the greenhouse gas C02 = higher temps and higher sea levels due to melting ice etc, which is exactly what is happening now."

Yep, and it wasn't down to Anthropogenic activity then, was it? It also did not produce anything catastrophic that would need anyone to "Save the Planet".

You seem to fail to realise that any form of sea level rise would occur so SLOWLY that it will not be the catastrophe that the Global Warming Alarmists would have us believe.

All those previous changes were NOT human-induced. They were natural variations and therefore nothing to worry about. They are meant to happen. Humans need to learn to live with it. Survival of the fittest perhaps? Worrying and panicking will not help you!

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#1088907 - 14/03/2012 16:04 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Dustydevil]
Brett Guy Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 5158
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
No Dusty Devil! Havn't you seen the documentaries that hollywood make. Sea level will rise in the form of a giant Tsunami that will take out the statue of liberty on the way in.

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#1088947 - 14/03/2012 16:39 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Brett Guy]
ROM Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/01/2007
Posts: 6628
This is a paper I haven't come across before.

Business and Economic Forecasting Unit,
Monash University

National center for Policy Research

Global Warming: Experts’ Opinions versus Scientific Forecasts [ Feb 2008 ]
Quote:
In 2007, the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) issued its Fourth Assessment
Report. The report included predictions of big increases in average world temperatures by 2100, resulting
in an increasingly rapid loss of the world’s glaciers and ice caps, a dramatic global sea level rise that
would threaten low-lying coastal areas, the spread of tropical diseases, and severe drought and floods.
These dire predictions are not, however, the result of scientific forecasting; rather, they are the
opinions of experts. Expert opinion on climate change has often been wrong. For instance, a search of
headlines in the New York Times found the following:

Sept. 18, 1924 MacMillan Reports Signs of New Ice Age

March 27, 1933 America in Longest Warm Spell Since 1776

May 21, 1974 Scientists Ponder Why World’s Climate Is Changing:
A Major Cooling Widely Considered to be Inevitable


Under this. Scientific Forecasting versus Opinion

A quote I just had to laugh at as it is so apt in the global warming ideology

" An earlier review of empirical research on this problem led to the “Seer-sucker theory,” which can be stated as “No
matter how much evidence exists that seers do not exist, seers will find suckers.
” J. Scott Armstrong, “The Seer-sucker
theory: The value of experts in forecasting,”
Technology Review, Vol. 83, June-July 1980, pages 16-24.

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#1088950 - 14/03/2012 16:45 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: ROM]
Arnost Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 10/02/2007
Posts: 3909
You may want to look at these failed climate and environmental predictions (over the last 120 years)

http://www.lowerwolfjaw.com/agw/quotes.htm
_________________________
“No. Not even in the face of Armageddon. Never compromise” ...

And this of course applies to scientific principles. Never compromise these. Never! [Follow the science and you will be shown correct in the end...]

Top
#1088970 - 14/03/2012 17:05 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Arnost]
ROM Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/01/2007
Posts: 6628
A remarkable preponderance of scientists in there.
Maybe they should all just shut up and stick to science instead of constantly making total fools of themselves.

And we are told we must respect and kowtow to those learned seers and scientific gentlemen [ and women ] who continue to debase the discipline of science with such foolish global climate predictions.

As a skeptic about most science nowadays [ call it grumpy old age ! ] I never forget that they pull on their pants in the morning just like I and a few billion others on this planet also do.
So they have to earn respect, not have it handed to them just because they, scientists, usually know a great deal about very little, most of which will turn out to be useless or wrong.

Edit; Or as one quite famous scientist said; Science is the only profession where you can be wrong all the time and still have respect and get well paid for it.


Edited by ROM (14/03/2012 17:11)

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#1088971 - 14/03/2012 17:06 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Arnost]
Brett Guy Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 5158
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
That is absolutely hilarious Arnost. Gotta love the ability of these so called 'scientists' to look out the window and predict more if the same to come.

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#1088989 - 14/03/2012 17:21 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Brett Guy]
Dustydevil Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 12/04/2010
Posts: 186
Loc: Darwin
Here is link to one of my all time favourites.
http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andre...ng_predictions/

Note particularly the FLUMMERIES by Flannery.

It is an oldie but a goodie. Enjoy.

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#1089000 - 14/03/2012 17:36 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Brett Guy]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14286
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Nice find Arnost, thats gone straight into my favourites Lol.

I have sent a story about the ABC news item to Watts up with that under my blog name "Mike the convict".
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785mm Jan
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#1089045 - 14/03/2012 18:08 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: Dustydevil]
MC Thomas Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 06/12/2004
Posts: 1119
Loc: Melbourne
Originally Posted By: Dustydevil
Here is link to one of my all time favourites.
http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andre...ng_predictions/

Note particularly the FLUMMERIES by Flannery.

It is an oldie but a goodie. Enjoy.


I will bite, why not.

"5. GIANT HAILSTONES WILL SMASH THROUGH YOUR ROOF

ROSS Garnaut, a professor of economics, is the guru behind the Rudd Government’s global warming policies.

He this year defended the ugly curved steel roof he’d planned at the rear of his city property, telling angry locals he was protecting himself from climate change: “Severe and more frequent hailstones will be a feature of this change,” he said.

In fact, even the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change admits “decreases in hail frequency are simulated for Melbourne. . .”

Lesson: Beware also of government advisers on that warming wagon."

Maybe he is happy with his ugly curved steel roof after the 6th March, 2010 hailstorm and the Christmas day storms of 2011. smile

(note: I am not saying that these storms are due to climate change)

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#1089064 - 14/03/2012 18:27 Re: Interesting news articles about AGW [Re: MC Thomas]
Brett Guy Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 5158
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
Fair call there MC and while you admit that these events were not due to climate change, according to BoM annd CSIRO they definitly were NOT a result of climate change. They did not say this directly mind you but certainly implied it when they have all but written off the current La-nina conditions and the weather it is producing as being but a blip on the global warming radar screen. Now I believe that if they write off one aspect of the conditions produced by La-nina then they have to write off everything produced by it.
Bet it doesn't happen though. They will pick the conditions that suit them and write off those that don't. Actually I think I ay have to look up whether or not they have already done this. Or perhaps ROM already knows and could tel us?

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