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#1139704 - 12/11/2012 14:00 Royal Commission Catholic Church
Cheers Offline
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Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
Should there be a Royal Commission into the Catholic Church about child sex abuse & the cover ups.
I say yes.
About bloody time.
Anyone who says NO must be hiding something,someone & trying to protect the Catholic Church.
Pell doesn't want it.
Why doesn't he want it.
Is he trying to hide something.
He looks very suspect to me.

As I said before.
IT'S ABOUT BLOODY TIME.

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#1139747 - 12/11/2012 17:49 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Julia has just announced a Royal Commission.
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#1139749 - 12/11/2012 18:35 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
refstar Offline
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Registered: 15/10/2012
Posts: 310
The Royal Commission is looking into any institutional bodies and the Police, not just the Catholic Church. Sporting clubs, Scouts etc etc.


Edited by refstar (12/11/2012 18:35)

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#1139751 - 12/11/2012 18:39 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: refstar]
Cheers Offline
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Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
Originally Posted By: refstar
The Royal Commission is looking into any institutional bodies and the Police, not just the Catholic Church. Sporting clubs, Scouts etc etc.

I think Pell & many others should be shaking in their boots.
About bloody time!

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#1139752 - 12/11/2012 18:42 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: refstar]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
As Arnoldnut knows I have been agitating for this to happen for a couple of years now - well done to all those concerned and yes it is time it happened now we just need the terms of reference to be broad enough to catch all these mongrels including those being hidden oveseas by the church.
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#1139754 - 12/11/2012 18:50 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
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Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Pell should aready be in jail along with his bishops - but thats just how I see the whole sorid affair because there wouldn't have been a cover up if the catholic church (and catholic policemen/women) didn't think it was above the law and actively prevented criminal investigations for occuring when the crimes where reported.

There will be a lot of blowback when this comes out from the top down and a lot of police and lay people will end up with a case to amswer for. Bring it on.
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#1139756 - 12/11/2012 19:02 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
Cheers Offline
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Loc: sevenhills nsw
Originally Posted By: SBT
Pell should aready be in jail along with his bishops - but thats just how I see the whole sorid affair because there wouldn't have been a cover up if the catholic church (and catholic policemen/women) didn't think it was above the law and actively prevented criminal investigations for occuring when the crimes where reported.

There will be a lot of blowback when this comes out from the top down and a lot of police and lay people will end up with a case to amswer for. Bring it on.


Spot on SBT.
I agree with you 100%

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#1139759 - 12/11/2012 19:12 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Seabreeze Offline
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Registered: 18/09/2005
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Loc: South West Rocks, NSW
Are there any reliable estimates on how much this Royal Commission is going to cost?

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#1139760 - 12/11/2012 19:15 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Seabreeze]
ozthunder Offline
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I won't mention which Prime Minster in waiting thinks the sun shines from Pell's xxx. I rest my case about the intelligence of that man ( well both of them actually).
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#1139761 - 12/11/2012 19:20 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Seabreeze]
Cheers Offline
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Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
Originally Posted By: Seabreeze
Are there any reliable estimates on how much this Royal Commission is going to cost?


Not yet but we have to have a Royal Commission,
No if's no buts.

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#1139766 - 12/11/2012 19:52 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Brett Guy Offline
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Definitely overdue. Find those responsible for the actions and the coverups and bury them. Not literally of course. It would be far better to see them suffer a somewhat similar experience in jail as they have dished out to others.

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#1139772 - 12/11/2012 20:36 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Brett Guy]
SBT Offline
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It doesn't matter how much it is going to cost, the Catholic Church has deep pockets and they will be able to afford whatever costs are bought against them, of course the money will ultimately come from the poor church goers who will have to ante up the funds to pay for this. (Well thats what has happened in the USA anyway after damages has been paid out to all the individuals that claimed)

But there should also be a punative action taken against the church and forfeture of some prime real estate will no doubt defray a lot of the original costs as well as build a couple of new wings in a few state prisions to hold all those found guilty.
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#1139780 - 12/11/2012 21:26 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
Steve777 Online   content
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The Royal Commission will cost tens of millions but we have to have it. This deplorable situation goes way beyond a few bad apples and strongly indicates that a systemic corruption that has taken root in the Church. It is absolutely essential that a strong light be shone into some very dark corners.

I am a lapsed Catholic. Even so, I recorded myself as a Catholic in last year's census. I respect the message, but now, for a number of reasons, not the institution. What I want, and what I am sure those still practising would want, would be for this vile corruption to be rooted out of the Church and those who perpetrate and protect it be exposed, feel the full force of the law and be removed from any position where they may harm vulnerable young children again.


Edited by Steve777 (12/11/2012 21:30)
Edit Reason: Clarification

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#1139783 - 12/11/2012 21:52 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
GDL Offline
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Registered: 17/02/2008
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This Royal Commission was called to seek justice and hopeflly compensation for the victims of sexual abuse.Most school teachers,clergy,scoutleaders,ect have the best interests of the children in their care as their primary concern and fullfil their duty of care well.The Royal Commission can do its job without our help by venting our opinions and preduces about other members religions or pollital parties,dont write anything that offend,what we will read and hear will offend all of us greatley. This will be painfull for those who have any affiliation with those orginisations who are to face examination and we should remember they are as keen as the rest of to see justice done while still remaining loyal.There is no hatred in justice,there is in predudice....................The guilty will be punished without our help.

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#1139805 - 12/11/2012 23:27 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: GDL]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Trust me guys, the Catholic Church are well protected and can't be sued.
They do not exist in Law in australia and at this moment there is no one to sue....google 'Pell vs Ellis NSW supreme court'

Time a few things were changed. No least a few laws.

Not over yet Wobbley ...but by [censored] we've made some ground on them. ;-)
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#1139809 - 12/11/2012 23:38 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
ColdFront Offline
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Registered: 29/06/2008
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Loc: Wide Bay..Near the beach
I'm fascinated by where this might end up. Don't be surprised if the former owner of a major tourist resort in Queensland gets a mention.

Pedophilia is simply the lowest act of all. May justice find a way.
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#1139844 - 13/11/2012 09:55 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: ColdFront]
slipperyfish Offline
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Registered: 28/11/2011
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Loc: Charters Towers
We agree on something CF.

Arnoldnut. You are right in regards to criminal law, and yes this needs changing, and this may well be the catalyst to those changes. However, and now I could be wrong, the findings may be the grounds for a civil suit. Civil suits in general are more public in regards to what information could be seen by the public. This may have far greater implications for the church. As far as the individuals are concerned, the law is the law, and may it come down hard on these monsters.

Funny really isn't it ? It has taken an atheist PM to finally take on the Catholic Church, after years of government hand over ears action.

Good on you Julia Gillard and the ALP for having the guts to stand up to this corporation.

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#1139853 - 13/11/2012 10:12 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: slipperyfish]
Tom1234 Offline
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It's about time something was done about this and i agree with those who don't really care what the cost is.

It really does take some guts to make this decision as there are still heaps of religious voters who may not agree with it.

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#1139859 - 13/11/2012 10:32 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Tom1234]
ColdFront Offline
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Registered: 29/06/2008
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Loc: Wide Bay..Near the beach
You raise an interesting point Enrique however the vast majority of people find this disgusting so I doubt it will even be a factor or sway opinion politically. The fact is regardless of who announced it ,it needed to be done! I have always been confused by the level of protection these vermin seem to be given and why chemical castration hasn't been maniditory for the likes of Dennis Fergeson. They ruin the lives and the innocence of children and their families ffs.

Perhaps the most unfortunate part of this RC is that it is projected to take up to 10 years to complete and many of the victims may not actually be around to see justice done. They have to start somewhere though.
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#1139875 - 13/11/2012 12:03 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: ColdFront]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
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Both arnoldnut and myself have access to the very documents that the catholic church use as Stanadard Operating Procedures when a case is bought forward by a victim and let me just say that the only thing they are interested in is stopping any investigation from gaining publicity. Usually accomplished by threats of ex communication as a starting point. Not exactly what you would expect to see from a religion that is supposed to care about it's parishoners now is it?

My guess is that Pell will suddenly be promoted to a special post within the Vatican and he will remain there until he dies as a means of stopping him from being investigated. Arnoldnut is right, the church itself is bullet proof but individuals aren't. No religion has any standing above the law.

If a crime has been committed and you played an active part in hidding it then you are guilty of conspiracy to prevert the course of justice no matter what position you hold within any organisation. If you knowingly fail to notify the police of a crime you are also guilty of a similar offence.
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2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1139988 - 14/11/2012 00:02 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: slipperyfish]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Thanks Slippery, I spotted a paedophile priest still teaching kids whom I'd assumed was long dealt with and set about getting him away from those young kids.
My own story is in Patrick Parkinsons submission to the vic parliament ....I started my run in 2000 ....slowly slowly as SBT knows wink and we will get there.
is here http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/fcdc/article/1786
My own submission is public but not up yet ....I have a hearing before xmas.
My own case is about the run around I've had since 2000 ..not the before!
The John Ellis vs Pell case exposed the problem as the judge says in the findings ....will take an act of fed parliament to change that.
.......is where this is all going cheers
Thank you STB ...we must go catch that fish soon wink


Edited by Arnoldnut (14/11/2012 00:05)
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#1140266 - 15/11/2012 10:33 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
story is breaking today ......ABC et al.
Nothing could be said until a local court case was over (rapson/vic)

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3633089.htm

It begins! wink
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=FE0wp0kd2-c


Edited by Arnoldnut (15/11/2012 10:35)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1141478 - 18/11/2012 07:29 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Everyone had much to say back in 2006
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189785/1
...what happened?? no one has an opinion any more!

Arnoldnut had been banned at the time and I was Dilbert for a while.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1141496 - 18/11/2012 08:26 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
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Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Probably too scared to say much Arnoldnut. Not like us.

http://www.instructables.com/id/medieval-stocks/

Just in case I have saved the plans and will start contruction if they call a tender. wink
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1141535 - 18/11/2012 09:43 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
SunnyDays Offline
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Registered: 30/01/2011
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Hey SBT and Arnoldnut smile

I have wanted to write a little something since the thread started (even before as I know it was brought up in another one) but it is on a topic that makes me literally sick in the stomach. Just wasn't sure what and how to say in explaining how I really feel and well today I am so tied after yesterdays storm activity, I'll probably wish I worded it differently.

People who commit these crimes against children make me SO angry and it brings tears to my eyes. Wearing my heart on my sleeve, I pray every week with out fail, that our police and investigative authorities into these matters are given the extra powers, tip offs and help to weed out pedophiles. AND most importantly rescue the children held captive. Every time I hear of mass arrests all around the globe it brings me joy and a smile to my face, like my prayers are being answered slowly but surely. BUT my heart breaks for the children, what happens to them cannot be undone and it scares me that the reality is, with every child rescued another inevitably takes it's place frown I remember a 60 minutes show some years ago of a police detective here in Brisbane I think it was, who works on these crimes (to rescue children), and how hard his job is looking through disgusting images and trying to track the origin of them. It touched me deeply since that day I have prayed.

The catholic church or any organisation that has sheltered these people have a lot to answer for. And I want them to pay dearly and for the full force of the law to come down on them and the individuals who have committed these heinous crimes. I really don't care how much it costs or how long this royal commission will take - it is necessary and am glad the PM agreed to it. Although I do hope it doesn't drag out and the resources are provided to see it done thoroughly, in less time and that money is not squandered in completing the royal commission.

I am so glad we have people in the world like you both who are passionate enough to 'take action' and to 'talk about it' like you are. It is not that WZ folk would be scared to comment, I would imagine it is more because of the very nature of these crimes, the very act of pedophilia is not something people want to think about because it is so sick. It makes us think of these terrible acts you just don't want in your head.

The most important thing is I want justice for those who have been victimised and will be hoping the results of the royal commission are what they seek and they need. That's all smile
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#1141554 - 18/11/2012 10:16 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SunnyDays]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Sunnydays, thankyou for your post. I helped out with some technical aid as well as providing a website for various people to hone their forum building skills and lending a symathetic ear when needed, providing some direction as well as floating some ideas. What I did wasn't a huge contribution by any means but it helped start a movement that has grown in strength. I too was abused many years ago but I fought back and halted it before it got too bad. Some people can't/couldn't do that and as such it is up to the rest of us to stand up and assist those who can't defend themselves.

I just watched an interview with one of the organisers for the Irish Investigation which was ham strung by only running for 5 years. This allowed certain parties to slow the investigations down and in the end dodge the whole process. They did uncover a huge conspiracy of silence that ran from the local parish priest all the way up to the upper echelons of government and ultimately to teh Vatican itself though and many of the guilty where prosecuted. He warned against an closed ended investigation and said that it should run it's natural course no matter how long or where it went and how much it costs. About the only thing I have ever seen from Juliar that I agree with.
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2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1141558 - 18/11/2012 10:23 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Rime Offline
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Registered: 07/06/2001
Posts: 1444
Loc: Perth,WA
Originally Posted By: Arnoldnut
Everyone had much to say back in 2006
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189785/1
...what happened?? no one has an opinion any more!

Arnoldnut had been banned at the time and I was Dilbert for a while.



To be fair, WZ has been dwindling in the past 5+ years and many of those members are long gone.

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#1141605 - 18/11/2012 12:01 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Rime]
GDL Offline
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Posts: 630
Loc: Bowen Mountain NSW
I hope that post about witch hunts hasnt made people afraid to speak their minds,it wasnt my intension to stop members speaking their minds. ....GDL

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#1141765 - 18/11/2012 15:09 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: GDL]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Originally Posted By: GDL
I hope that post about witch hunts hasnt made people afraid to speak their minds,it wasnt my intension to stop members speaking their minds. ....GDL


my submission to the vic parliamentary inquiry starts out about when I first started out in 2000 I was seriously concerned about this ONE paedophile priest who I had come to learn was still teaching young children in Samoa.
My focus was on this one priest ....never imagined the rest of it!

we have all been fooled for year GDL ..I think Michelle's audio is an awakening for all. Made me storm around angry as hell ...every step of this will be painful for someone somewhere ....not a nice thing at all.
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/prog...rothers/3240858

only heard it a few years back and gave me new found determination.
Michelle submission is public I think on the parliaments website.....this is a 2007 RN radio show

still know plenty of the old crew ...see them on my facebook etc ...sometimes I just drop in ;-)


Edited by Arnoldnut (18/11/2012 15:12)
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#1141789 - 18/11/2012 15:29 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Originally Posted By: SBT
Probably too scared to say much Arnoldnut. Not like us.

http://www.instructables.com/id/medieval-stocks/

Just in case I have saved the plans and will start contruction if they call a tender. wink


just a thought! wink (language warning)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=qDO6HV6xTmI

best I leave it there though poke ....will say that George reminds me of SirBT


Edited by Arnoldnut (18/11/2012 15:33)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1142298 - 18/11/2012 21:42 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
GDL Offline
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Registered: 17/02/2008
Posts: 630
Loc: Bowen Mountain NSW
Scary stuff A.T iam to gob smacked at the momment to even try to make a comment. ....GDL

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#1142412 - 19/11/2012 09:14 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: GDL]
Arnoldnut Offline
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I'll explain a few things which many may find interesting ...SBT was assisting us to set up SNAP .....hhere in Aus. Here is thhe proxy one that was set up in it's place.....I backed away because I caused a focus by the religious order that I was taking to task.
http://www.snapaustralia.org/
te order themselves set up this site against our own (SNAP (our Org was set up year before in te USA and we were had registered SNAP in Australia over the prevoous few years as a .org.au (have to be a registered org to have that org.au is australia ....not ture of plain .org)
http://snap.donbosco.asn.au/index.php/en/
at the top of that page you will see Julian Fox writes the Samoan Youth story
Julian is one of the three mentioned in Patrick Parkinsons public submission to the victorian parliamentary inquiry.

I stepped away from our SNAP org as SBT well knows.
But SNAP AUS excists despite all the bulls#it and has sponsored Tom Doyle into Aus ....you'll see him on the telly today. (ABC I'll bet)
:Listen to that gentleman .....he will say it as it is.


All this is out in the public arena
http://www.theage.com.au/national/anger-...1029-28fox.html


Edited by Arnoldnut (19/11/2012 09:16)
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#1142417 - 19/11/2012 09:31 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: GDL]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Originally Posted By: GDL
Scary stuff A.T iam to gob smacked at the momment to even try to make a comment. ....GDL


http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/prog...rothers/3240858

absolutely leaves you breathless ....every parent that has a child in care will wringe their hands.

is why I'm doing this dirty job ....I think most parents will understand ....I have grandkids myself and it is about them more than anything else.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1144388 - 25/11/2012 08:59 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
First Victims to actually get heard in a public forum.
Anthony and Chrissie Foster explain what these animals have been doing.
http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3640045.htm

I spent the day at thhe inquiry ....lots been said thhat didn't go to air.
heads ups SBT, SNAP Aust gives a submission on monday ...Barbara Blaine president of SNAP USA is here also.
(all in hand Wobbley ...may be calling on you soon heheheheheeeee ....we are in negotation hehheheee....but keep your cards close SirBT wink )


Edited by Arnoldnut (25/11/2012 09:04)
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“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1144393 - 25/11/2012 09:33 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Well I never thought I'd see it in my lifetime ..near the whole vic crew that made this happen were there at the parliament Mike. Wish you could have been there for the back slappin' smile
not over yet but little steps have turned to big of late ...we got our parliamentary inquiry and it's tipped over into Royal Commission.
All that crazy has panned out well I thoughht.
Ian gave his submisssion after Chrissie on Fridays arvo ....Mark will step up on Monday
(Ian's visiting Mark today ;-)...watch out for some Ccs)

Some may think I''m talking in riddles ....but everyting will gell as this moves forward.

I'd suggest the term 'Ontological' although unknown to most will be the most learnt word by the aussie public over thhe next few months ...some will even be able to spell it smile
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“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1144591 - 26/11/2012 10:09 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
No need for backslaps Arnoldnut.

I was just happy to help start it off and yes I have been watching it all develop with interest. From such small beinings a avalanche has started. 2 grumpy old farts, a sense of moral outrage, a website and pulling together people from all over Australia to a cause that won't die. Never underestimate the power of good to truimph over evil.
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1144885 - 26/11/2012 23:42 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
Cheers Offline
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Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
What I can't understand is that why would anyone have anything to do with the Catholic church when it's full of these type of low lives.
And they hide them as well.
It must be brain washing because I can't work it out.

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#1148118 - 08/12/2012 09:24 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
I'd already been fighting this battle for many years even before I started this old thread
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189804/1

never dreamed we'd get to a Royal Commission in my lifetime. cheers

Tonite they are screening ABCFourCorners''Unholy Silence' aggain ......I'm the bloke in the program with the axe. wink
Am hoping to get a gernsey on the crucifixion squad.
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/guide/abcnews24/201212/programs/NC1204H001D2012-12-08T200140.htm

a few programs have already run this last week
http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2012/s3649350.htm
&

http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2012/s3649351.htm


Edited by Arnoldnut (08/12/2012 09:30)
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“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1148123 - 08/12/2012 09:45 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Make it known Guys! only public pressure has seen this get this far!

It needs to be discussed sensibly and in the open. Secrecy is their friend and needs to be put down.

however contrary to popular belief, humour is essential bounce
....the more cynical the better poke

You get like that after surviving the snow storm. wink
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1148662 - 11/12/2012 17:08 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Compass Special: CHURCHES ON TRIAL
ABCOne 8pm Tuesday 11 December

CHURCHES ON TRIAL shows how the church cover-ups and shifting of priests allowed abuse to happen again, and again; how the reluctance to punish offending priests, and the alleged 'buying off' and 'silencing' of victims has frustrated and angered them further.

And, it reveals how church strategies designed to bring justice and healing for survivors, like "Towards Healing" and "The Melbourne Response", have been found wanting.

http://www.abc.net.au/compass/
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1149343 - 14/12/2012 13:25 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
DaveM Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 21/05/2001
Posts: 9249
Loc: Bathurst NSW about 700 m asl
Originally Posted By: Cheers
What I can't understand is that why would anyone have anything to do with the Catholic church when it's full of these type of low lives.
And they hide them as well.
It must be brain washing because I can't work it out.


Cheers and others.

Not every member of the Catholic Church has done these horrible things. The vast majority of priests/nuns etc have only ever tried to do good and to try and teach messages of care for our fellow humans.

SOME have done things that we all hate. It does not mean they are ALL bad.

At it's core, the church(es) are about trying to help the world around them and to try and help us all be kind to those around us.

I have seen many of the good things the churches do, the people they help, the programmes to help those much worse off than most of us.

I have seen the majority of priests and nuns horrified at the things that have happened. Please do not assume they are all bad, that is completely wrong.

Anyone in the church(es) with a conscience knows that these things are horrible, but please don't shoot the innocent with the bad.

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#1149370 - 14/12/2012 14:31 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: DaveM]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Too true Dave, many good people have been let down by their bosses and the associated behaviour in their not protecting kids.
So people can understand some of this that has occurred ...I'll make it simple ....only one item but a key one.
Every professional organisation or group has to have a Professional Standards Committee (usually made up of a mix of disinterested professionals) who oversee their behaviour and outcomes and write a report each year on how they are going, doctors/nurses/shrinks/dentists/counsellors/etc
...which is published for all to see.

anyway, a Patrick Parkinson who was doing this for the church ..he was actually writing a review for the church over many years, found a 'perversions of justice' (his words) and plenty of etc 's.
The reports are all pretty well up now on the Vic Inquirys website ...these I am told will carry over to the Royal Commission
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/fcdc/inquiries/article/1789
Patrick Parkinsons submission is but a short read ...some emails etc in there. ........the Vic police sunbmissions are an eye opener also.
Patrick Parkinsons submission<=LINK
Patrick Parkinsons submissionREVIEW<=LINK

You are quite correct Dave ...many good people being hurt ....but needs to be done....anyone doubting need only listen to Michelle Mulvihill
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/prog...rothers/3240858
http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2012/s3651319.htm
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1149380 - 14/12/2012 14:48 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
DaveM Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 21/05/2001
Posts: 9249
Loc: Bathurst NSW about 700 m asl
Nobody with a true conscience can deny that justice must be served.

All I am saying to people is that it is a MINORITY of people who have done these horrid things.

I know quite a number of wonderful priests and nuns who are completely horrified by it as well. The sad thing is that many of these wonderful caring and peaceful people are being taunted and sneered at when they are NOT involved and never have been.

I know in my local church that these things are spoken of and against many times a year. The church as a whole finds these deeds/actions abhorrent.

Sadly things were not dealt with well enough (sometimes with the perhaps MISGUIDED thought of saving embarrassment to all concerned - including the victims)

I ask though, please remember that the church(es) have many wonderful, loving and caring people who only want to help their fellow man. Don't tar them all with the same brush.

By all means we must help the victims any way we can and offenders must be identified and stopped. It is a shameful episode perpetrated by a few but it is also doing great damage to those who are only guilty of trying to live life helping the world around them.

We need to target the wrongdoers not those who have done no wrong.

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#1149555 - 15/12/2012 07:53 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: DaveM]
Blizzard Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 31/03/2001
Posts: 10341
Loc: Blue Mountains
Originally Posted By: DaveM
Originally Posted By: Cheers
What I can't understand is that why would anyone have anything to do with the Catholic church when it's full of these type of low lives.
And they hide them as well.
It must be brain washing because I can't work it out.


Cheers and others.

Not every member of the Catholic Church has done these horrible things. The vast majority of priests/nuns etc have only ever tried to do good and to try and teach messages of care for our fellow humans.

SOME have done things that we all hate. It does not mean they are ALL bad.

At it's core, the church(es) are about trying to help the world around them and to try and help us all be kind to those around us.

I have seen many of the good things the churches do, the people they help, the programmes to help those much worse off than most of us.

I have seen the majority of priests and nuns horrified at the things that have happened. Please do not assume they are all bad, that is completely wrong.

Anyone in the church(es) with a conscience knows that these things are horrible, but please don't shoot the innocent with the bad.


Yes, very true. My wife is catholic and you couldn't find a more funny, kind, compassionate person on this earth. Some of my mates (I'm not catholic) from her church are just the most decent, helpful people you would meet. Tragically, many thousands of children are abused in this country every day by atheists, agnostics and theists alike.

My life experience has led me to be involved in helping abused kids and whilst painful to see the suffering, its very rewarding to help them.

Every day across Australia, there are thousands of child sexual and physical abuse cases in your local street but they get less news attention than the church events.

The real issue here is protecting our children from predators, in whatever environment that occurs.

Child abuse is child abuse and of course those in the Catholic and Protestant churches have to pay for their evil acts. So do the many thousands of households in this country where child sexual and physical abuse is going on at this very moment.

Lets do our bit and get involved where we can to help prevent this terrible evil against the wonderful children of this country. If you suspect something is going on, carefully consider the option of reporting it. Never turn a blind eye, that child needs you.

I can assure you, many childrens lives are literally saved by responsible adults reporting abuse.

Keep an eye on my Twitter account, I plan to do another fundraiser next year. smile
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#1149612 - 15/12/2012 12:57 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Blizzard]
Cheers Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
My wife was brought up a Catholic but is non practising.
I have many,many friends that are the same,Practising but most non practising.They are good people.
I was brought up as an SDA but not only am I non practising I also don,t believe in fairy stories.
Religion is a form of brain washing & the raming of their unjust rules,fairy stories etc is a form of child abuse in it's self.
As a child you don't know any better.
You will go to Hell if you don't believe this or abide by these rules,etc.
Nearly all religions seem to have God on their side.
Some are evil,some are not.
The Catholic Church has alot to answer for & that doesn't just include the child abuse.
Contraception is one of them.
If anyone goes on about God this or God that to me then I quickly let them know where I stand.
If they keep going on then I give them a mouth full.
You don't need Religion with all their rules,etc to be a good person.


Edited by Cheers (15/12/2012 12:58)

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#1149783 - 16/12/2012 07:58 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Royal Commission is about the culture of hiding these paeds ..not the paeds themselves....
here is one opinion....be it a bit clinical. wink
There have been a couple of Royal Commissions here that have been duds. But on the whole, they have been very successful in dealing with things like corruption in police forces, and in setting up institutions to deal with such things.
I don't think the history of Royal Commissions here gives us reason to be pessimistic. Sure, many of their recommendations have not been adopted by governments for various political reasons, and to that extent some have not been very effective, but even there they have been effective in revealing the rotten state of things, and often in changing a culture.
And I think we have to recognize the extent to which the secular State has forced the Church to change its ways. The Australian bishops had been talking about doing something about clerical sex abuse from about 1988, but it took a police raid on a bishop's presbytery in 1994 when he followed the instructions of Crimen Sollicitationis in refusing to hand over his files to the police, to make them act. Out of this came Towards Healing which at least, on paper, required reporting.
It took threatened legal action against Cardinal Murphy O'Connor for misprision of felony in 2001 for the British bishops to get Lord Nolan to prepare his report and to get a concession from the Vatican to allow reporting. And all hell was breaking loose in the United States over cover ups that led to the Dallas Conference and the Vatican concession there in 2002.
And then in Ireland, you had the extraordinary attack on the Vatican by the Catholic Prime Minister of Ireland, and the severing of diplomatic relations with that most Catholic of countries, all because of the Murphy and Ryan Commissions.
Finally, in 2010, Benedict abandons the cover up policy, and again, at least on paper, requires bishops to cooperate with the civil authorities - which in most countries means mandatory reporting of sex crimes by anyone, not just clergy.
The interesting thing about Australia is that despite its being given an exemption from the secrecy provisions of both Crimen and Sanctitatis, the cover up seems to have continued. I have little doubt that this occurred because in 2002 you had the extraordinary situation of the highest Vatican Cardinals still saying publicly, that it is not the bishops role to dob in criminal priests to the police - despite exemptions given to places like Australia to do so.
The career paths of priests and bishops in a monarchy rely on the patronage of the Pope, as much as it did with Louis XIV and his nobles. You can see this in the separate Melbourne Response which did not require reporting, because in the State of Victoria, misprision of felony had been abolished and not replaced with something like S.316 of the NSW Crimes Act. The end result was that there was no obligation to report. On the other hand, all the other Australian bishops (even those in Victoria outside the Melbourne Archdiocese) wanted mandatory reporting. There is little doubt that the Melbourne Response was more in accordance with Vatican policy, and one more likely to have kept the Curia happy.
Now the chickens look like coming home to roost. One can only hope that the interference of the Vatican in Australian affairs will come out in this Royal Commission as effectively as it did with the Irish Commissions.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1149788 - 16/12/2012 08:22 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
in my own case I was attempting to expose paeds that were still operating in Samoa ...the stories is well documented here in the treads of WZone that goes back to 2002 (some on the old forum)

Fr.Chris Riley of sydneys YOTS has even assisted me and has provided witness to my own case for the Victorian Parliamentary Inquiry ....all evidence will go over to the Royal Comm.

If anyone wants to give a donation to anyone at all ....you couldn't get better than YOTS
http://www.youthoffthestreets.com.au/

Chris Riley ran a broom thhru thhe original group when he took over many years ago ....Fr EvansSDB was the last one he nailed before breakin right away and setting up YOTS.

I myself was a street kid for many years after running from a catholic boarding school ...hopefully the amount of runaway kids on our streets will be reduced as this Royal Commission removes one of the most persistant suppliers/causes of these street kids.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1158140 - 13/01/2013 10:35 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic


"It is alleged that from 1960 to 1990, when Rupertswood was a Catholic boarding and day school, Salesian brothers, including two former school principals and a boarding master, routinely abused boys in their care."

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/national/the-hell-house-20130112-2cmia.html#ixzz2Ho2D35mK

I spoke on ABC's Four Corners last year about the hiding of paedophile priests as recent as 2000 & 2004
http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/06/28/3535079.htm
And now it is a criminal investigation ...I have yet to speak with the Parliamentary Hearing whichh is coming to Bendigo shortly.
Professor of Law Patrick Parkinson, who also spoke on 4Crns, has already given his submission about the Salesians.
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/fcdc/inquiries/article/1789

Here's a piece of a vid of myself attempting to explain the complexities to ABC's Four Corners
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4s5HhMAcD3c&list=ULDvwiwfpreN4

This ain't over yet wink


Edited by Arnoldnut (13/01/2013 10:37)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1158203 - 13/01/2013 14:36 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Cheers Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
Hmmm,Pell has been very silent recently.

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#1172890 - 17/02/2013 10:13 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Early this coming month I am giving evidence before the Inquiry and chosen to do it 'public' (not incamera private) ....I'll be opening with a quick run through the weatherzone thread
Canon Law Vs Australian Law http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189805/1
Sydney Uni Legal Professor Patrick Parkinson has already delivered a damning report based on my case in 2000.

This is about the churches Canon Law being used in australia (all over the world) to protect paedophile priests and their heirarchs using this circumstance to conceal and move them about.

Mea Maxima Culpa - Silence In The House Of God' is a movie just screened in USA and coming here in March
(SirBT will recognise one of our SNAP leaders in this movie)
http://viooz.eu/movies/15909-mea-maxima-culpa-silence-in-the-house-of-god-2012.html

I think Vicvtorians can be proud that their goverance was the first in the world to take these guys to task ...which has led to the Royal Commission .....the Vic Inquiry has been extended another 5 mths as the weight of people wishing to give witness has snowballed.

the world looks on as little state of Victoria makes history ....followed closely by the Aus Royal Commission.

and why bother? some may ask.
Right at this moment I can point at a known paedophile priest who is close to children in his capacity as 'assistant' with LandCare
he'd be happy LandCares focus is to get kids involved this coming year ...fresh meat supplied hey?

that guy can't be touched (yet!) and he has been through a Canon Law court case where the church payed off his victims and moved him to where he is now ...working in the community.
He is but one .....he is but one too many in my book !!!!!


and it ain't just me .....I tripped over this Canon Law after a tip off from someone who sent me a copy of the Crimen Solit.???.. can't spell...back in 2002
But you will see now that every legal eagle is spouting this Canon Law /Crimen ...It will be the centrepoint of the finding ...just watch ;-)

I do this for my fellow abused students who didn't make it ...so many have taken their own lives over this.


Edited by Arnoldnut (17/02/2013 10:22)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1173074 - 17/02/2013 20:48 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
GDL Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 17/02/2008
Posts: 630
Loc: Bowen Mountain NSW
Its good to see you are well and full of fight Arnold,if its good men that do speak up then you are one of the best.Take it to them for yourself and those fellow students who cant speakfor them selves,shine the light on these mongrels. ......GDL

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#1173518 - 19/02/2013 08:45 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: GDL]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
I'm just the same as any aussie ....I don't take being bullshitted to ....very well is all.

This was my business and racing team before I started this fight 13 years ago
http://www.pedders.com.au/news/1/0/pedders-racing-gives-toyota-86-a-racing-debut
(the guy who wrote that was obviously on coke)
http://www.drivermagazine.com.au/news/2012-pedders-bendigo-motor-sports-display.html

I'd taken this to everyone from the attorney general thru forgeign affairs and even to the governor generals good offices.
I had audiences with all and all said zero can be done.

Bullshit I said ;-) .....have to be honest and say I gave up for a while ...but a few of us got together and got Ann Barker MLA to fly to Ireland and speak with the attorney general there.
Vic inquiry doesn't have the teeth the Royal Commission has .....the latter can investigate senior police and senior policians involvement.

australia is the first to actually investigate at a govt level ..have to be proud of Aus for standing up against them ...biggest corporation in the world.
I gave up a magic lifestyle to get this done for grandkids sake ....nothing in it for me as my abusers dead and long gone but is well documented and so a centrepoint.
I'm just one of thousands ...and I try to speak for all ...please take an hour or so out of your own lives and have a look at this movie and what some suffered at the hands of these guys and their laws that keep this hidden.
Is said to be a big part of the reasoning behind the Popes resignation.
http://viooz.eu/movies/15909-mea-maxima-culpa-silence-in-the-house-of-god-2012.html
Will be on Australias SBS in March







Edited by Arnoldnut (19/02/2013 08:50)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1173523 - 19/02/2013 09:03 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
feel I need explain ....in the middle of this journey a senior legal bloke investigated my case and found a perversion of justice and took it straight to the victorian attorney general.
he is Patrick Parkinson (heaps of letters) .......and his submission is here (is one of the tags)
http://www.theglobalmail.org/feature/healing-be-damned/556/
and Pat's submission specific to my case
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/images/...ndicies_1-5.pdf
he even has the famous pic I posted here on the zone back in 2006
http://i1006.photobucket.com/albums/af184/Michael_Scull/GeoffreyRobertsonInTheNews/0619klepcandy.jpg
thanks for listening guys.
rainy day here so nothings going to upset me today .....haven't seen rain here in yonks. So might go play in it poke


Edited by Arnoldnut (19/02/2013 09:12)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1175824 - 24/02/2013 19:05 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
...


Edited by Seabreeze (24/02/2013 19:32)
Edit Reason: Inappropriate image for the topic removed.
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1176959 - 26/02/2013 10:35 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Churches protected by trust laws

Victoria leads the world in taking these guys to task ....followed closely by the Royal Commission.
my hearings early next mth ....have a listen to the vid as it explains how the catholic church has made itself Unsueable and so untouchable.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1183558 - 15/03/2013 07:52 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
gave witness at the Victorian Parliament Hearings yesterday ....and a meeting with Taskforce Sano bosses and found everyone is on the same page as myself.
Lack of State Laws of misprision is the problem ...removed from our statutes by Law Reform in the 50/60s ....Now the interest is what droive those reforms .....and who.

Was an interesting day ...afraid I can say little as most would understand.
leave you a tune to consider ....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyl5DlrsU90
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1191276 - 26/04/2013 13:15 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Salesian priest Julian Fox has returned from the vatican and appeared in melb magistrates court this morn and the case has been arraigned until July.
Many have been trying to get this guy back for many years ...the Salsians order themselves has to appear before the Vic Parliaments Child Abuse Inquiry on monday also.
some snaps I took ...his fault they are fuzzy. he wouldn't stay still for me. frown

Fr. Julian Fox SDB outside the Melbourne magistrates court this morn


From the amount of media present I believe it will be well covered in this evening news.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1191390 - 27/04/2013 06:34 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Salesian Catholic priest returns from Vatican
to face court on child sexual abuse charges

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-04-26/sa...348?section=vic

the salesian bosses will be ask by the Victoria Parliamentary Inquiry on Monday to explain their moving of paedophile priests overseas to avoid prosecution here in aus.

I'd guess the Royal Commission will be next for the Salesians to explain themselves.



Edited by Arnoldnut (27/04/2013 06:39)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1191428 - 27/04/2013 10:35 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Probably be quite a bit of tap dancing will be performed by them in court I would guess.

I still have the plans for my stocks and could quite easily scale them up to hold multiples of those deem fit to use them Arnoldnut. Hmm maybe make them in a closed circle and work on a mechanism to rotate them.

Keep up the good work mate.
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1193326 - 10/05/2013 12:00 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
SBT, it may also be a good time to corner the market in millstones. poke

check out what Des has to say in the last half.
Cops and Catholicism: the cultural connection between police and the church

Keep in mind some of my own testimony and also the fact the Vic Inquirys guidelines don't encompass the police or govt dept etc.
the plot thickens.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1193447 - 11/05/2013 14:06 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Been following the Newcastle affair Arnoldnut. Fox by name Foxhound by nature. A few dozen more like him would see this fully exposed in no time.

I have no doubts that the church thinks it is coated in Teflon but all it takes is good men (and women of course) to stand up and be counted for evil to be destroyed.

Hang tough mate.

It ain't over till the fat wombat warbles. wink
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1194809 - 20/05/2013 20:59 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Archbishop of Melb Denis Hart
Hart gives evidence at Victorian child sex abuse inquiry <= link
George Pell speaks to the Parliamentary Inquiry next monday.

getting that crowbar in the crack now hey! ...all that chipping away is starting to pay off Wobbley. cheers

listen for the bit about the known paedophile being made spirirtual adviser to another paedophile. ......was Klep.
Bloke's a star hey! crazy
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1194814 - 20/05/2013 21:30 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
have a listen at 24min23sec
.....then consider what we discussed here.
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189802/1
and there is an earlier thread also ....that Dilbert was a hot head poke

26:08 says lots about the attitude.
Restricted in Law .....he's talking about Canon Law





Edited by Arnoldnut (20/05/2013 21:37)
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#1195840 - 27/05/2013 12:15 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
paulcirrus Offline
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Definately a bad lot these religeous people.
Why do thay all drive flash cars, aren't they supposed to show that they are giving everything up for the poor.
Never seen them even arrange large concerts to help fix the starvation problems, but then again all the singers would be asked to peddle the faith
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#1195841 - 27/05/2013 12:20 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Brett Guy Offline
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It's not so much that religious people are bad. Rather IMHO it iis that organised religion is a bad thing. You can have faith without being part of a corrupt, controlling and greedy organization and youdonn't need these organisations to tellyou what constitutes good behaviour. Given the past record of the organised religions mind you it seems a little ironic to take advice on good behaviour from them period.

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#1195920 - 27/05/2013 18:12 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
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Saw a new form of dancing this evening on ABC 24 - it's called the Cardinal Pell two step.
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#1195970 - 28/05/2013 01:12 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Originally Posted By: SBT
Saw a new form of dancing this evening on ABC 24 - it's called the Cardinal Pell two step.


It regressed into a back step today poke
http://www.abc.net.au/iview/?series=3152075#/series/3152075

I'll just say that I was chatting with Katie today, as her helpers were negotiating Parliament House steps with Katies wheelchair, and all she did was go on about how proud of her dad and mum she is.
broke me up I can tell you .....rather not say how I feel about these guys ...isn't constructive really.

But this vid is ....tells an honest story.


Edited by Arnoldnut (28/05/2013 01:14)
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#1196050 - 28/05/2013 14:37 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: paulcirrus]
Rime Offline
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Originally Posted By: paulcirrus
Definately a bad lot these religeous people.
Why do thay all drive flash cars, aren't they supposed to show that they are giving everything up for the poor.
Never seen them even arrange large concerts to help fix the starvation problems, but then again all the singers would be asked to peddle the faith


Is this suppose to be sarcasm?

That is just plain ignorance in the highest order. Do you really think that a Salvation Army chaplain drives around in a brand new Merc or BMW?

Are you saying that the Salvation Army and many other religious organisations around the world have done nothing for the poor?

As for starvation problems, who do you think started great leave relief programs like World Vision and Red Cross? All of them had some form of religious origin.

Yes, by all means religion has had their massive failings, but this charge is false.

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#1196145 - 29/05/2013 07:36 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Hey Rime, do we need to jump on each other ...I noticed Bret disagreed also but didn't take over the thread with it.

the Royal Commissions about protecting kids into the future and we all need open our minds a bit and absorb a few peoples comments.
All these slurs etc aren't just based in a vacuum ..as was the 'catholic paedophile priest' has been the source of jokes and innuendo for many many years ....but by the look of it was not unfounded at all.

as in the Victorian Inquiry where they aren't trying to establish IF there were paedophile priests.
The Inquiry is investigating the HIDING/Concealing/facilitating paedophile priests and who facilitated this at the time.

Archbishop George Pell 's questioning by the Vic Parliamentary Inquiry on monday of this week is here in full.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-05-27/george-pell-fronts-victorian-sex-abuse-inquiry/4715796




Edited by Arnoldnut (29/05/2013 07:38)
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#1196147 - 29/05/2013 08:02 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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those looking for the conspiracy theories need not be disappointed
SBT was helping me put together a website for a newly formed chapter of the USA's SNAP
'Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests' ..many of us travelled from all around Aus to Adelaide to incorporate SNAPAUS.ORG.AU in australia.
all rubber stamped by SA govt and we were having Skype conferences with other chapters of SNAP throughout the world.
I was to be the webmaster and SBT had given us a pledge of two years of assistance for starters.

anyway, we all poured our heart and souls into this SNAP.Org.Au when along comes the Religious group I had been pointing at and smashed our best layed plans.
http://www.theage.com.au/national/anger-...1029-28fox.html
Our Snap .org.au was disallowed and I got a please explain from the fed govt controlling body asking me wghat I was trying to do?? Certainly got twisted around ...was too much bullshit happening to be anything but having it ppoured on us ....history now.

Mark Fabbro was at the original meeting in adelaide and is now the contact point in sydney if anyone needs SNAP AUS
It was my involvement that attracted the Salesians to do what they did.....so I resigned and distanced myself.
their other claim to fame is slander
http://www.theage.com.au/national/salesians-accused-journalist-20110830-1jk2h.html
nothing much said of them of late as taskforce Sano is still questioning them while others are on fresh charges (see earlier post re:Fox)
http://watchdogblog.dallasnews.com/2013/...e-charges.html/



Edited by Arnoldnut (29/05/2013 08:06)
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#1196255 - 29/05/2013 18:53 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
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Dirty deeds done by the church including hijacking the name are all part and parcel of the farce they continue to try and hide behind. All being exposed now and Pell got a ripping at the inquiry in Melbourne that won't sit well with the masters in Rome either.

Ways and means around most things when it comes to websites and names. Any time you want me to step back in and help just holler Arnoldnut.

If we had deep enough pockets we could have bought every variation of the name and renewed it every year and locked everyone else out of using it. But we would have needed to continue to do this on an annual basis.
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#1198546 - 12/06/2013 08:06 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Dirty Deeds Done Dirt Cheap
prefer this one but
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWzRuoFFjH0
so true SBT! But I think we did a pretty good job on our bit of causing the avalanche ..you can be proud of that.
Best we focus on our fishing now as the snowballs formed ....and nothin' gunna stop it.
the SpannerMan in the uSA is doing a fine job at arms length running the SNAPAustralia web site these days ...you should drop him a line SBT as he'd appreciate it. http://www.snapaustralia.org/ ..I know you have his email.
Marco and Nikki are doing a fine job ...considering they are in NSW
The Royal Commission will sort this out ...has the tools and I think it was you who said McClelland WILL get the docs! (or people will be in contempt :noddiesmilie: ...most here wouldn't know about Maralinga I suppose ....but I think he learnt a few lessons there that will help him with this one.


Edited by Arnoldnut (12/06/2013 08:10)
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#1198657 - 12/06/2013 16:04 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: paulcirrus]
DerekHV Offline
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Originally Posted By: paulcirrus
Definately a bad lot these religeous people.
Why do thay all drive flash cars, aren't they supposed to show that they are giving everything up for the poor.
Never seen them even arrange large concerts to help fix the starvation problems, but then again all the singers would be asked to peddle the faith


You could probably say that about some Pentecostal and Evangelical churches (eg Hillsong)- but most orthodox churches clergy-like Catholics and Anglicans, live very modestly.


Edited by DerekHV (12/06/2013 16:04)

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#1198661 - 12/06/2013 16:15 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
DerekHV Offline
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Originally Posted By: Cheers
My wife was brought up a Catholic but is non practising.
I have many,many friends that are the same,Practising but most non practising.They are good people.
I was brought up as an SDA but not only am I non practising I also don,t believe in fairy stories.
Religion is a form of brain washing & the raming of their unjust rules,fairy stories etc is a form of child abuse in it's self.
As a child you don't know any better.
You will go to Hell if you don't believe this or abide by these rules,etc.
Nearly all religions seem to have God on their side.
Some are evil,some are not.
The Catholic Church has alot to answer for & that doesn't just include the child abuse.
Contraception is one of them.
If anyone goes on about God this or God that to me then I quickly let them know where I stand.
If they keep going on then I give them a mouth full.
You don't need Religion with all their rules,etc to be a good person.


Whilst your comments are fairly typical of irreligious people, who have made their own rules in life, not all ""religion"" is blanket bad.
There are definitely some problems even within Christianity, and that is mainly the exclusivity of certain groups that believe they are the only ones in the truth.
Many Catholics, including my family are ""pick and choose"' in what they believe and don't follow the idea of Papal infallibility, so things like Contraception are not adhered to.


Edited by DerekHV (12/06/2013 16:16)

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#1198805 - 13/06/2013 12:26 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: DerekHV]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Originally Posted By: DerekHV

Whilst your comments are fairly typical of irreligious people, who have made their own rules in life, not all ""religion"" is blanket bad.
There are definitely some problems even within Christianity, and that is mainly the exclusivity of certain groups that believe they are the only ones in the truth.
Many Catholics, including my family are ""pick and choose"' in what they believe and don't follow the idea of Papal infallibility, so things like Contraception are not adhered to.


Too true derek, so many good people being hurt by this stereo typing and I'd be the first culprit. Please excuse my wrath earlier but has been such a long haul. I do note your careful words and appreciate them. the last 13 years have been an education ....strangely derek some of the best support I've had has been from fellows that left the priesthood ...among many however. But I can say I know more than a score of ex-priests ..some barristers who have put in submissions to the Commission .....near all concerns an abuse of Canon Law etc and the rest goes on and on.
But I see the waters muddied further with this 'petition' ....shame is Geoffs interview on ABC 7:30Report left most victim/survivors screaming after his opening statement ....Geoff needs get back and explain himself i think ....or it's more of the same.
damn shame the whole thing .....I think catholics are getting a taste of how many good moslems feel in their own everyday here in Aus.
Both a shame and unfounded .....best we all wait for the Commission. Even the State inquiries don't have the balls to get there and stop and expose the enabling .....I'm hopeful McClelland will :-)
My mum was secretary of the womens auxhilary at Our Ladys Elgar rd for 27 years ...she got a special mention is why I know. But there is part of the problem as I'll guess you accept ...always the Aux.
(pretty sure even 'bowls' clubs threw that out yonks ago!! :-) )


Edited by Arnoldnut (13/06/2013 12:29)
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#1198851 - 13/06/2013 14:41 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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I feel this is a good explanation of how it got this way ...and is but a very small part of a much bigger problem ....as exposed already in the Vic Parliamentary Inquiry.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tt9D7DrT93s

I think that vid says it all.
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#1198911 - 13/06/2013 18:10 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: DerekHV]
Cheers Offline
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Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
Originally Posted By: DerekHV
Originally Posted By: Cheers
My wife was brought up a Catholic but is non practising.
I have many,many friends that are the same,Practising but most non practising.They are good people.
I was brought up as an SDA but not only am I non practising I also don,t believe in fairy stories.
Religion is a form of brain washing & the raming of their unjust rules,fairy stories etc is a form of child abuse in it's self.
As a child you don't know any better.
You will go to Hell if you don't believe this or abide by these rules,etc.
Nearly all religions seem to have God on their side.
Some are evil,some are not.
The Catholic Church has alot to answer for & that doesn't just include the child abuse.
Contraception is one of them.
If anyone goes on about God this or God that to me then I quickly let them know where I stand.
If they keep going on then I give them a mouth full.
You don't need Religion with all their rules,etc to be a good person.


Whilst your comments are fairly typical of irreligious people, who have made their own rules in life, not all ""religion"" is blanket bad.
There are definitely some problems even within Christianity, and that is mainly the exclusivity of certain groups that believe they are the only ones in the truth.
Many Catholics, including my family are ""pick and choose"' in what they believe and don't follow the idea of Papal infallibility, so things like Contraception are not adhered to.

Some problems. NO,A LOT OF PROBLEMS!

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#1199223 - 16/06/2013 05:45 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
ABC Radio National have an extended interview that is available to listen to now
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/spiritofthings/rocking-the-cradle-catholics/4746316
Is an insight into how it got like this ...a mother of a victim explains some aspects ...is a painful education for all catholics as to what was going on within.
The Royal Commission is about the hiding of these guys ...not the paedophilia itself!
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#1199938 - 20/06/2013 10:58 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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>Judy Courtin helped prepare a submission for a group of survivors in Ballarat and introduced the group to a hearing of the Victorian parliamentary committee into institutional responses to child sex abuse. This work was undertaken on a voluntary basis.

Our attitudes towards religious institutions – in particular the Catholic Church – has changed as scandal and controversy afflicts the former bastion of faith. AAP/Simon Mossman

>As a young girl in the 1960s, I attended a Catholic boarding school. The nuns could be scary. When they walked the wintry and un-illuminated corridors of the convent, their knee-length rosary beads jangled against their ankle-length black habits.
A conversation with Judy Courtin <= Link
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#1202766 - 08/07/2013 04:47 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Quote:
Given that instruction in Catholic seminaries also hugely benefited from injections of government funding — and given that after 1968 the number of seminary candidates within Australia had plunged — houses of priestly formation became little more than dumping-grounds for publicly funded homosexual cliques. Just how pernicious these cliques were, during the 1970s and 1980s above all; how much they owed to the influence of fellow homosexual activists like the sinister church-employed psychologist Ronald Conway; how successful their infiltration of Australian Catholic management actually was; and how, in the prevailing atmosphere of unsupervised Dionysiac license, ordained heterosexuals found it easy to rape underage girls: these four stubborn facts have emerged — as has much else — with horrifying ancillary detail. They have emerged for two reasons and for two reasons alone: the ease with which the Internet allows shocked Catholic laity in Australia (unconstrained by the local print media’s absurdly punitive defamation laws) to demand official action on the church’s scandals; and still more, the Victorian parliament’s current inquiry into religious sex abuse.

http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/australia/item/15921-supping-with-the-devil

First time I've seen it written clearly. First became aware of this when I was researching the Salesians and the Vincentians.
(is well documented now ..many charged lately....in the last few weeks actually)
Keep in mind I left church and had zero interest until 2000 again when I exposed a few paedophiles in the system ...I'\d known nothing of what had been occurring since my fleeing boarding school as a 15yrold in '68.
My submission to the Parliamentary Inquiry pointed out that in 2000 I thought the church "needed to know it had a paed"
Little did I realise they had plenty ....which is what I unearthed when I started my own investigations.
This quote about is what I feel occurred but never have I seen it written clearly anywhere.

Is the mums and dads of our five million odd aussie catholics whom need to know about this travesty at the heart of the system .....in the seminaries!!!
Call them confused being homosexuality is a mortal sin in 'their' religion. ....confused would be an understatement I think. I have no issues with homosexuals ...but to twist it like this will do no one any good.


Edited by Arnoldnut (08/07/2013 04:56)
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#1204768 - 21/07/2013 05:49 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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I was on ABC Four Corners speaking of the crimes that occurred at my old school.
The mother of another student who was abused at the college spoke also of how the priest had escaped to the safety of the vatican and refused to come back to face charges.

well the pressure of that FourCorners program and subsequent submissions to govt we got our Parliamentary Inquiry ...while at the same time the Newcastle thing spilled out after the Father F affair ...was Four Corners open that one too.
http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/06/28/3535079.htm
anyway, the bloke who escaped to the vatican has decided to come back
http://www.ozteacher.com.au/news/vic/vic-priest-former-teacher-to-face-sex-abuse-committal/23040

damn happy he isn't wandering around anymore

Patrick Parkinson says it plainly in the video on that page.
http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/06/28/3535079.htm
He accepted a submission from myself and found a perversion of justice and reported it to the attorney general ....etc

Still there are barely any conversations about this ..logical and balanced discussions I mean ....Catholica is probably one of the few ...Catholic papers are in denial .....no mention and for christ sake they have a Royal Commission started and have nothing to say.
I won't bore you as it's hurtful to some and obscure to others why anyone would bother.
Just been too long coming sorting this one ...needed doing I think most will agree.
I see Wobbleys having a holiday heheheee ....Big Hi to Wobbley.
and the old forum would have congratulated Kylie also ....more power to you sweetheart. :-)


Edited by Arnoldnut (21/07/2013 05:51)
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#1205320 - 25/07/2013 11:56 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Anyone who is following the Newcastle Inquiry may be interested in this video of Patrick Wall. http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2013/s3699078.htm

Painful time for many and less said the better. While we weren't bred to be mushrooms either wink
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#1205373 - 26/07/2013 06:19 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Moral Vacuum

excuse my cynicism. poke
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#1205477 - 27/07/2013 14:08 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
I'm back. Look out world.
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#1205498 - 27/07/2013 17:51 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
GDL Offline
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Registered: 17/02/2008
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Loc: Bowen Mountain NSW
Where did you go SBT your humor has been missed. .....GDL

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#1205528 - 28/07/2013 09:11 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Coped a month ban for a transgression of the rules - wink

It seems that in many walks of life I have trodden on toes, caused angst and started or at least assisted in the exposure of the grubs of the world including the fiasco which is the peds in the catholic church and people get upset when an old fart speaks out.

No beg your pardons from me.
If I see a wrong I do something about it.
It was how I was bought up.
Never back down from a bully, right wrongs where you can and never compromise on your principles. I have integrity, a strong sense of right and wrong and see things in black and white. Grey areas are for cowards and sooks as is politically correct anything.

I have standards, they may be low but at least I have them. Mike Busby 1992
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202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1205587 - 28/07/2013 20:13 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
GDL Offline
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Registered: 17/02/2008
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Loc: Bowen Mountain NSW
Mike One should never apoligse for having a strong point of veiw,men who walk tall dont have low standards,men who right wrongs can look back and smile to themselves. .....GDL

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#1205609 - 29/07/2013 00:43 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Glad to see you back Mike.
Did you see where my old school Rupertswood ...is planned to become the most exclusive hotel in Australia. the Fathers have big plans apparently ....they have it under a trustee arrangement ..of course.

I was talking with a couple of survivors of the place and were wondering if the management would be interested in running an advert on their website.
http://www.rupertswood.com.au/
We thought we could earn a few pennies by doing Tours for the Ghouls.
says here ...quote "some operators would see the dark history as a valuable point of difference".

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/rupert...l#ixzz2aLr2Hbqc

Sounds like these guys are still cashing in on others misery!!

theirs is coming!


Edited by Arnoldnut (29/07/2013 00:45)
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#1205622 - 29/07/2013 08:56 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Just emailed the parliamentary inquiry about this .....written replies is what I prefer.

sunny here ....not a cloud..yet!


Edited by Arnoldnut (29/07/2013 08:56)
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#1205626 - 29/07/2013 09:22 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Bloody church will try to profit out of anything it would seem.

But never forget, Karma is a bitch apparently.
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2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
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#1207306 - 15/08/2013 13:48 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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ABC Lateline ran a show some may have missed.
Same lawyer I had at my mediation ...wonder who he was working for on the day/days?


Australian Broadcasting Corporation
Broadcast: 08/08/2013
Reporter: Steve Cannane
The Royal Commission into Child Sexual Abuse is taking submissions into the Catholic Church's Towards Healing protocols........
http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2013/s3821560.htm

& the associated interview attached to the program.

The CEO of the Catholic Church's Truth, Justice and Healing Council, Francis Sullivan discusses the role of the Catholic Church's insurance company in how the church handled cases of sexual abuse by clergy.
http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2013/s3821565.htm
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#1208366 - 27/08/2013 12:40 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Quote:
>A jury has been urged to overlook attempts to discredit the evidence of eight men who allege they were sexually abused as boys by a Catholic priest while at a boarding school.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/victor...l#ixzz2d8J8lOK7

The original home of "The Ashes" is getting more infamous all the time.
This is another from my old school that Taskforce Sano has exposed/not least the Vic Parliamentary Inquiry ....great trail of ex- principals of my old school have gone before the beak now ....a few more to go yet ;-)
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#1211474 - 26/09/2013 00:21 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Peter Gogarty is a friend and in the very least I owe him this post.
http://www.theherald.com.au/story/1799537/victim-tells-of-parents-loss-of-faith/?cs=303

> Peter Gogarty's transcript /submission starts at p2504

http://www.lawlink.nsw.gov.au/lawlink/Special_Projects/ll_splprojects.nsf/vwFiles/TOR2_Submissions_24_Sept_2013.pdf/$file/TOR2_Submissions_24_Sept_2013.pdf

Quote:
.......However the prospect that individuals subject to Australian civil law may be directed by people in another jurisdiction to ignore that law is a matter which I'll be bringing to the attention of the Royal Commission.....


p2511 line 12

I aired this failure of law here on the Zone in 2006 ....will be part of my submission to the Royal Commission ...I'll thank Mark for allowing that thread at the time.
'Canon Law vs Australian Law' in 2006
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189805/1
Vic parliaments findings will be out on the 15th Nov ....then we move on to the Royal Commission.

In 2000 I notice an old teacher/priest I knew to be a paed pictured coaching an under 14s footy team. I told my wife I would take the friday off as I had something to sort away from the office.
What a can of worms it turned out to be.




Edited by Arnoldnut (26/09/2013 00:27)
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#1211499 - 26/09/2013 08:55 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
State Laws of 'Misprision of a felon' are the ones that were removed from victorias statutes in the 60s ....now the question is who and why was that done?

Canon Law's Crimen Sollicitationis imposed the secret of the Holy Office and automatic excommunication for anyone who breached the "strictest confidentiality" for "all persons and in all things".

All the missionary work of the Church to make converts through the front door with its Eucharistic Congresses, missions and more recently World Youth Congresses is a waste of effort if the faithful are fleeing out the back door because of "scandal", which Archbishop Hart explained to the Victorian Parliamentary Committee was the loss of faith when those who represent Christ (priests and bishops) act contrary to his principles. So, the solution was to hide the crimes - which they did.

The 1983 Code of Canon Law continued "pontifical secrecy" for sex crimes against children, and the 2001 Motu Proprio reimposed it again, and so did the revision in 2010. There are no exceptions for reporting these crimes to the police, but the 2010 revision proposed a change in the future so that when bishops protocols are approved under Canon 455, in which there will be a requirement to report where the civil law requires it, then canon law will be changed for that particular region.(like was done for NSW thru 'Towards Healing'(confused now hey?)
But pontifical secrecy will still apply where there is no law requiring reporting.(as is the case in Victoria where Pell set up the 'Melb Response; seperate from the others to use this difference in state law)) And, as I have explained before, other than NSW there is no law requiring reporting of historic abuse in Australia, ie where the victim is now an adult.

The only inference from this is that the Vatican wants to get away with not reporting priests to the civil authority wherever it can.

Now, this has nothing whatsoever to do with the permissive society, or secularism, or relativism, but with clericalism - the desire the protect priests from the civil law wherever they can get away with it, and to protect the Church from scandal.

excuse the depth of conversation here but I have seen lots about Sharia law on this forum while few know about how Canon Law plays it's part in screwing us over here in Aus.
We all live and learn.


Edited by Arnoldnut (26/09/2013 08:59)
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#1218905 - 15/11/2013 08:57 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Strangely the world is taking more interest in this than aussie citizen are .....be proud to be in australia, the first country to take them to task.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-13/pa...136?section=vic

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-14/ge...762?section=vic

slowly getting there

http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/


of course this had all been discussed here on Weatherzone in the past

http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law

appears it's all about them following canon law and not aussie law.









Edited by Arnoldnut (15/11/2013 09:00)
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#1223323 - 02/12/2013 13:29 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
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Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
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202mm April 2017
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2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
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#1223846 - 05/12/2013 09:43 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Thanks SBT, was the Principal of my school in the years after I left ....but not only.

Here Patrick Parkinson explains what basically I'll be taking to the commission Friday next.
Key church lawyer alleges cover-up

I will be demanding a public hearing but need organise that at this 'private' meeting on the 13th (read the guidelines)

Patrick ain't scared to call this particular group a criminal organisation ....nor I.

wish me luck ;-)


Edited by Arnoldnut (05/12/2013 09:46)
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#1224191 - 07/12/2013 08:44 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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a response from the church.....
Responsibility for response to sexual abuse of children
Catholic Communications Office, Thursday 5 December 2013
http://www.cam.org.au/News-and-Events/Ne...en#.UqJANyeglp6
FRANCIS Sullivan, Chief Executive of the Truth, Justice and Healing Council delivered a major speech to more than 100 people at St Patrick’s Cathedral Hall in Ballarat on 20 November, 2013.
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#1224253 - 07/12/2013 22:52 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ant Offline
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Registered: 05/10/2002
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I know that name. He was head honcho of the AMA (the doctors' union)until recently. Before that, CEO of some Catholic organisation.

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#1224762 - 12/12/2013 15:17 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Royal Commission can be viewed live here each day

http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/newsroom/webcasts/


Edited by Arnoldnut (12/12/2013 15:17)
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#1226102 - 22/12/2013 07:07 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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quote from wxzone 2006
"get it straight....I did exactly what you said and I ended up in Towards Healing.....I outlined what happened to me under that scheme here in the thread and that isn't enough (they straight out deceived me...and with international flights involved it was a big 'they').....that was Canon Law pure and simple...they tell you that!

This was not in the old days but in the year 2000 .....so I pity the next person who has no option if this govt doesn't change their attitude and take these cases to court.
Remember the Towards Healing org is set up just to deal with these problems under Canon Law ....and is Govt sanctioned.
Trust me ....no one wants to touch these cases and in most the perpetrators don't have any trouble with pleading guilty (it almost relief) but the church around them seems to want to ignore the stats on the fact they will most likely abuse again......and stick them back in circulation.

Not from fact but from experience, I blame the authorities on both sides church and govt for keeping the facts about these guys secret and thereby putting our children at risk for in some cases decade after decade and nothing changes.
.....Canon Laws recognition by the likes of this government is the cause of this continuing and I for one am sick of reading about the same guys decade after decade.
....all our biggest paedophiles come out of this screwing around that everybody prefers to do instead of facing the facts and stopping them before it goes farther.
Fr Fox is living in the vatican and under the protection of the vatican .....how ever last year he travelled to Amsterdam and Vienna I believe.....he wouldn't come to australia as their is warrants here....he's still payed by the church and his exploits are very well documented.
Fr Fox was one of the priest from our notorious school and has been processed with Canon Law and again is well documented on the net.....but I'm a little tired and you can do it yourself wink
Julian Fox is his name....probably travelling in europe at the moment (worries me)
"
"
Taken from an earlier 2006 thread 'Canon Law Vs Aussie Law' http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law


however now Julian Fox is in melb awaiting trial.

On monday I attended a private hearing focusing on this Towards Healing and Canon Law. The Commissioner among other things has asked me to submit this earlier thread and wants me to a public hearing in the new year. Is about showing some chronology of my whingin'
No one need get their knickers in a knot being any names or identify chat will be removed.
I need thank Mark and the mods for allowing it when many wouldn't.
Has been a major support to me ..not least the people I met here cheers




Edited by Arnoldnut (22/12/2013 07:16)
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#1226317 - 24/12/2013 11:10 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Hang in there mate.
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
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2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1226321 - 24/12/2013 12:24 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ozone doug Offline
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Registered: 06/11/2006
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Loc: Roma SW QLD Eye to the S Wes...
All the best to you mate ,Its been a long haul. And merry christmas .cheers Doug
_________________________
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#1226381 - 24/12/2013 21:04 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
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last xmas my lad, who's in his 40s, gave me this video with a big wink ..was after the inquiry was announced and we'd wasted ten odd years.
Charlie and Boots
what mth is the least hot in Townsville Mike? I can see a well overdue fishing trip will be central to our conversation at xmas dinner tomorrow.
he has two lots of long service uop his sleeve and itching to use it this coming year.
Thought we'd wreck his 4wd for a change anyway.

All good Doug, Thanks.
You have a good one too!




Edited by Arnoldnut (24/12/2013 21:05)
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“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1226481 - 26/12/2013 10:08 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
July gets down to single digits on at least one day a year Arnoldnut.
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1233769 - 23/01/2014 15:15 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
anyone wishes to watch the Commission live can do it here..
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/newsroom/webcasts/

Makes interesting viewing.
anyone have a method of recording this better than my 'lappy filming lappy' method ...please advise ;-)

July you reckon ...hmmm...maybe ;-)


Edited by Arnoldnut (23/01/2014 15:18)
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“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1233844 - 23/01/2014 18:54 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
PM sent to Arnoldnut but for those playing along at home and looking for similar software try this http://www.polderbits.com/ software. Not free but has an unrestricted 7 day free trial.

Suggested by a member from Longreach.
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1234159 - 25/01/2014 00:15 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Fine piece of software :yes: SirBT ....loaded up and working fine ....might even buy it. (has been known to happen)

I found the Royal Commission was really getting into it today ....mediators being found to be nursed by the churches lawyers etc (overnight even, they were right onto it) ...bit of perjury ...this and that!

'paperwork' was given as the reason ....truth is it is their Canon Law with it's 5 year time limit that stops them ejecting the guy ....and the insurance company telling them how high to jump ...or not!

getting interesting but!

I need some paperwork from you Mike ....outline of the time you spent helping SNAPAus ...on a letterhead ....going to Commissioner Coate ...an outlines fine (if you watched the commission today you'll know that we best not prompt each other on this at all ....or could get reamed later :-D



Edited by Arnoldnut (25/01/2014 00:19)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1234253 - 25/01/2014 13:53 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
No worries mate. Will suppy as requested.
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1234430 - 26/01/2014 10:51 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
two paragraph is enough SBT ...barristers only look for key words after that.
you could watermark the page with a boab tree of course ...I think it would be fitting ;-)
Is just to reinforce and outline all the work that was stymied ..will be but a reinforcement of how the battle had been fought over the last 10 years of so.

in some ways some of the public education started here at WxZ and even well before that on the old Weather Channel forum.
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law
in it's 14th year now since I first pointed at a priest teaching Samoan children whom I knew to have been a paedophile.
To sit with the highest court in the land and be taken seriously for a change has put some semblance of trust back into my feelings about our goverance ......to be asked now to submit my 13 years of files of course does not quite excite me as much :-D.
Thought you could give me a hand with that bit Mike ...not that it was any small effort as I know I'm not the best pupil :-)

two paras on what we did ...a para on your thoughts on 'my crew' ...and a para on the impact on you and yours.
All relevant.

I do it in the open here folks ....as we are all sick of sneaking around in the background to get this public awareness of what's been going on for eons.

Please all have a good day today and celebrate what a forward thinking country we live in despite all the surface garbage that keeps the media employed.
I wish I could convey the depth of discussion I had with Commissioner Coate last mth. But has caused me to celebrate my first aussie day in more than ten years.
Trust me when I say they are grasping the concept now! ;-)

Jennifer Coate while being a commissioner of this Royal Comm is normally an Australian judge, and the current State Coroner of Victoria. She is the first woman to be appointed to the position. Until 2006, she served as the first female President of the Children's Court of Victoria.

We're in good hands I reckon.







Edited by Arnoldnut (26/01/2014 10:52)
_________________________
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#1234432 - 26/01/2014 11:09 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
And why do we persists with this some may ask ???



keep in mind these are early figures for Ballarat area alone .....is out over 40 now.

Don't miss the fact this Commissioner is also the Victorian Coroner.


and our yanky mate Steven Spaner is doing a find job Mike. You should look him up and compare notes ..I know he'd love to hear from you wink http://www.snapaustralia.org/

shame we never got that .au hey? smile ...another day maybe wink


Edited by Arnoldnut (26/01/2014 11:13)
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“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1240092 - 07/02/2014 21:39 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
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may have been a rocky road SBT but the team got there in the end ....despite what was thrown at us. Some would remember this..... http://www.theage.com.au/national/anger-...1029-28fox.html

Hope you didn't miss the UN report
After a long investigation - that included both written and in-person data and testimony from SNAP - the United Nations panel of experts concluded that the Vatican:

-- "still places children in many countries at high risk of sexual abuse,"
-- "has consistently placed the . . . the protection of the perpetrators above children’s best interests,"
-- "has policies and practices which have led to the continuation of the abuse by and the impunity of the
perpetrators.”
actual report here http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/documen...-sex-abuse/777/

Here are just few of the hundreds of headlines across the world:
"UN Panel Blasts Vatican Handling of Sex Abuse" – Washington Post,
"U.N. Report: Vatican Policies Allowed Priests To Rape Children" – NBC News
"Vatican Let Abuse Go On for Decades" – NPR
U.N. Panel Criticizes The Vatican Over Sexual Abuse" – New York Times
"Kick out Those Who Sexually Abused Children, UN Panel Tells Vatican" – CNN

I originally started off here talking about Canon Law and Aussie Law
Here's the latest out today on that point.
Kieran Tapsell. The United Nations and the ‘Warts-and-all’ history.
http://johnmenadue.com/blog/?p=1242

Royal Commission will be studying this stuff carefully ...is pontifical secrecy dressed up.


Edited by Arnoldnut (07/02/2014 21:41)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1241631 - 13/02/2014 00:00 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
desieboy Offline
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Registered: 31/12/2002
Posts: 3108
Loc: Broome


Imagine all the stuff that happened that never got reported or revealed over the last 40 years ....but not just the catholics me thinks...
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- Mark Twain

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#1244366 - 24/02/2014 08:16 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
This Royal Commission is about the institution knowingly allowing known paedophiles to remain secretly in our communities.

W/end Australian carried a strong article on the top of front page: "Vatican attacks abuse victims, offered payout to ‘appear concerned’". The article is behind a paywall and not readily accessible.

>"10-year-old rape witness denied aid, labelled 'voyeur'"

>A 10-YEAR-OLD boy, who witnessed the repeated classroom rape of girls at a Toowoomba primary school, was allegedly labelled a "voyeur" by Catholic Church lawyers.

>Despite his being a witness in the conviction of teacher Gerard Vincent Byrnes for raping and molesting 13 girls in 2007 and 2008, the church has refused to acknowledge he might have suffered long-term damage from seeing fellow students abused.


>While offering compensation to the girls -- after revelations of a cover-up of an earlier complaint to the school principal by Byrnes' first victim -- it has refused financial assistance for the boy. ... ...

similar article in herald-sun free
http://www.theherald.com.au/story/2105164/decree-shows-churchs-face/?cs=305

Live to air this morning .....questioning by the Royal Commission of Bishop Bill Morris, who looks like he was sacked by the Vatican because he wanted to sell church property to pay compensation to victims.
Is the culmination of a week of questioning to find out how the church mishandled the sexual abuse of 13 young girls in 2007/8
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/public-hearings/about-public-hearings/
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1244371 - 24/02/2014 08:51 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
The Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse

At 10 oclock the live screen will appear on this page
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/public-hearings/about-public-hearings/

being the hearings in queensland this morn it may be 11am ....but keep checking as the screen just pops up ....also the audio comes in fits and starts as they try to redact some names etc.
Commissioner McClellan says often that they want the community to watch the proceedings and so they do their best to deliver the hearings to us.

Excuse the babble but many think they have a bad connection or similar ...when it's the Commission itself that is controlling the feed.
Amazing technology to have this major hearings delivered to our home PCs

Also anyone can go to SNAP http://www.snapaustralia.org/ and there is always a tag there to the Royal Commissions latest.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1244685 - 26/02/2014 17:39 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
"Secrets of the Vatican" on PBS
....watch it here.... http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/secrets-of-the-vatican/

Very powerful and very accurate.

I feel privileged to know several of the amazing folk who are in this documentary.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1246123 - 06/03/2014 15:36 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Peter Gogarty's book is out
http://www.judaschurch.com/
(excuse the spelling errors ...about to be fixed!)

Some background
http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2010/s2902098.htm

The Royal Commission starts again Monday with John Ellis Vs George Pell
remember this....
http://davidshoebridge.org.au/2011/09/21/the-catholic-church-vs-john-ellis/

"The Catholic Church can not be sued because it does not exist in australian law " ...go figure!

well you can watch it here live on the web come monday ......
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/public-hearings/case-study-march-2014/
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1248094 - 10/03/2014 10:37 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Royal Commission
Monday with John Ellis Vs George Pell
'live' here
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/newsroom/webcasts/
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1248298 - 11/03/2014 00:20 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
These two parents are brave souls!! And proud to call them friends. They both showed up to support me at my parliamentary hearing which I found incredible after all they have been through themselves. Take a moment and listen to these two please.
ABC 7:30 Report from this evening
http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2014/s3960517.htm
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1250661 - 24/03/2014 07:43 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Catholic Cardinal George Pell appears before the Royal Commission into the Handling of Institutional Child Abuse today ahead of him heading for the Vatican to take up his new job running the Vatican Bank.

Can be watched 'live' on line from 10am today.
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/public-hearings/about-public-hearings/

why these guys have a tax free status astounds me. ..while also avoiding responsibility being they don't exist as a legal entity in australia (the Ellis Defence) All to be fleshed out in the next few days.

This is not about the paedophiles ....this is about the hiding of paedophiles.
see earlier thread .... http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law



Edited by Arnoldnut (24/03/2014 07:44)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1250675 - 24/03/2014 10:09 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
ABC New 24 have announced they are broadcasting the hearing live at the moment:

www.abc.net.au/news/abcnews24/
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“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1251109 - 25/03/2014 16:51 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Anthony and Christine Foster - George Pell not telling the truth.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2UC7pFyAho
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#1252099 - 28/03/2014 19:56 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Rape victims' parents say George Pell vowed to review Church compensation payments


http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-28/ra...payouts/5353008

Watch the full report on Lateline at 10:30pm on ABC1.

_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1252110 - 28/03/2014 20:37 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
vid...
Breakthrough for Foster family in battle with Catholic church
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-28/breakthrough-for-foster-family-in-battle-with/5353278
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1260199 - 17/04/2014 09:34 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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Quote:
>If this were some dumb corporation – some downtown retailer, say – a far lesser abuse scenario would have seen heads roll, many and large. Were the abuser Joe Blow, he'd be jailed as a rock spider. Were the abuse organised, secret, power-protected, woe betide, especially the ringleader.


http://www.watoday.com.au/comment/cleani...l#ixzz2z5yKOb9L
_________________________
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#1260257 - 17/04/2014 17:55 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
1996 Four Corners Program 'TwiceBetrayed' in four videos. Banned in Victoria and unavailable since that 1996 viewing.

Part One.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMsbRR40X4g
Part Two... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tj_ZHfXfsPg
Part Three..... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uA9MGawM7hc
Part Four... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVTnYhcAwPg

Is here also...
http://www.snapaustralia.org/
....right hand side /down two flicks

FOUR CORNERS
Investigative journalism at its very best

TV PROGRAM TRANSCRIPT
LOCATION: abc.net.au > Four Corners > Archives
URL: http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/s72926.htm

Broadcast: 27/05/96
Twice Betrayed
This story is about the crisis within the Roman Catholic Church over sexual abuse. After decades of inaction, the Church is facing its day of reckoning as a legal and financial showdown looms. Four Corners reveals the cover up that left the victims twice betrayed.

and now in 2014

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/paedop...0408-36bb7.html
_________________________
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#1261943 - 02/05/2014 07:53 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Royal Commission hearings into the handling of abuse in the recent past is finding the catholic bosses/bishops as well as insurance companies all conspired against the victims to minimise and conceal what has been going on.
Some of the Orders that came out from the mother country were all paedophiles /problem clergy ..sent out to the 'colonies' basically to get rid of them.
Christian bros for example started off with four and became the biggest group of abusers of the lot./Bindoon etc
While abuse and concealment of paeds in other Orders runs right up to present day ..not historic at all.

Read the transcripts before you start blurting out how that 'cant be true!'
Unfortunately it is!

There's only one other human organisation I can think of to compare the vatican to and that's the North Korean Government.

Dear leader is dear leader because dear leader says so.



Edited by Arnoldnut (02/05/2014 07:54)
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#1267514 - 25/06/2014 14:29 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/bb3eaadf-9283-41ef-9694-e560738d186a/case-study-14,-june-2014,-sydney.aspx
you may need cut and paste the link to the live Royal Com
ArchBishop Wilson is speaking at the moment.....

Do hope some are watching and the testimony is about Canon Law vs Aussie law
.....full circle hey!
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law


Edited by Arnoldnut (25/06/2014 14:34)
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#1268233 - 30/06/2014 13:15 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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todays live hearing Case 13
...Marists <= LINK

gone to lunch at the moment
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#1268344 - 01/07/2014 16:22 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Convicted child sex offender appears in witness box at royal commission

http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2014/s4036672.htm
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#1268700 - 05/07/2014 11:03 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Vatican refuses to hand over documents to royal commission

http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2014/s4039920.htm
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#1273927 - 21/08/2014 12:02 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Live feed of George Pell appearing by videolink before the Royal Commission at 4pm today

http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/791fd480-ba30-45bc-ba79-cbad85f27023/case-study-16,-august-2014,-melbourne

(you'll need cut and paste I'm afraid???)
Richard Leder, melb's catholic archdiocese solicitor being questioned at the moment.


Edited by Arnoldnut (21/08/2014 12:04)
_________________________
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#1273936 - 21/08/2014 14:09 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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'The clash between canon and civil law at the Royal Commission

One of the problems with Towards Healing that Professor Patrick Parkinson identified was that it appeared to be inconsistent with canon law.

The hearing into the Melbourne Response now makes it clear that it also suffered from the same problem. Toward Healing required reporting to the police wherever the civil law required it. In all States, there was a requirement to report children at risk, but not all of them applied to clergy. Victoria, for example, had no obligation on clergy to report.

New South Wales was the only State that required the reporting of “historic abuse”, that is, where the complainant was then an adult.

The 1996 Towards Healing document required bishops to comply with all reporting laws for sexual abuse. The Melbourne Response had no equivalent, but then it did not need one, because there was no requirement to report any abuse, historic or otherwise.

But a common feature of both schemes is that the assessor under Towards Healing and the independent Commissioner under the Melbourne Response were also authorised to be the bishop’s delegate for the purposes of carrying out a preliminary inquiry under canon 1717 of the Code. By reason of Art.1(4) of the decree, Secreta Continere of 1974, the allegations and any information under such an inquiry were subject to the pontifical secret. The imposition of the pontifical secret was confirmed in the amended procedures under Sacramentorum Sanctitatis Tutela of 2001 and again in 2010. There were no exceptions for reporting to the police until 2010 when a dispensation was given when there was a civil law requiring reporting. That dispensation did not apply to Victoria because until this year, there was no law requiring reporting. The pontifical secret still applies.

Until 2010, any compliance with S.316 of the Crimes Act in NSW was in breach of the pontifical secret, but a way was found around canon law by having counsellors do the reporting. Counselling a victim was never part of any canonical procedure to discipline the priest.

In Melbourne the Independent Commissioner had the right to report to the police if he considered it appropriate, but subject to his obligations of confidentiality. He was obliged to encourage the complainant to take the matter to the police, “where appropriate”.

In evidence both to the Victorian Parliamentary Inquiry, the Independent Commissioner, Peter O’Callaghan indicated that he never personally reported any such matters to the police, and the most that he would do would be to arrange for the complainant to see the police if they indicated a willingness to do so. Indeed, O'Callaghan was challenged on 20 August 2014 as to whether he positively discouraged complainants in two cases to report their abuse to the police. He denied, that, and no doubt the Commission will be making a finding of some sort on that issue.

Since O'Callaghan did himself report any allegation or evidence to the police, issues of the breach of canon law did not in practice arise in terms of reporting to the police. However, because there was a compensation panel involved, his report containing the allegations and the finding on the evidence were submitted to the panel. This constituted a breach of the pontifical secret in his role as the bishop’s delegate under canon 1717.

In January 1997, Cardinal Castrillon the Prefect of the Congregation for the Clergy wrote to the Irish bishops who had submitted their Framework Document in 1996 for comment. It contained a proposal for mandatory reporting. The Congregation advised that their proposals for mandatory reporting “ give rise to serious reservations of both a moral and a canonical nature” and that “the procedures established by the Code of Canon Law must be meticulously followed under pain of invalidity of the acts involved if the priests so punished were to make hierarchical recourse against his Bishop.” In other words, if bishops report these crimes to the police, any canonical action to discipline the priest will be rendered invalid if the priest appeals to Rome.

In the Nestor case, considered by the Royal Commission, Bishop Wilson had placed Fr Nestor on “administrative leave”. The Congregation ordered his reinstatement because the appointment of the assessor in that case did not comply with the requirements of canon 1717, and in any event, the concept of “administrative leave” only applied once a canonical penal trial had started and not before.

There were other cases in Melbourne where Archbishop Pell’s decisions were set aside by the Congregation for the Clergy for similar reasons. Professor Parkinson has said,

“The complaints procedure has been grafted onto existing processes, or created alongside existing processes, but without having any formal standing in the rules of the Church...The lack of consistency between the complaints procedure and the law of the Church has been a problem in the Catholic Church in Australia….As a consequence, the best intentions of the Church leadership in Australia concerning the removal of offenders from ministry have not always been achieved.”


This is still going to be a problem for both the Church and the Royal Commission, particularly because of the imposition of the pontifical secret under canon law. The whole problem could be resolved if Pope Francis accepted the demand of the United Nations that it abandon the pontifical secret over its internal inquiries and that it make reporting to the police of all allegations mandatory.

On 26 July 1990, Dr Nicholas Tonti-Filippini, a Catholic ethicist advised the Australian bishops:

“For the sake of the Church, reasonable suspicion of a crime must be reported to the authorities. Any attempt to contain it within an in-house investigation and management risks bringing the Church into disrepute.

The chickens have now come home to roost, as Dr.Tonti-Filippini predicted.'

....a quote from the author of Potiphar's Wife. Kieran Tapsell ....this afternoon we will all hear Cardinal Pell's explanation to the Royal Commission by webcast at 4pm.
_________________________
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#1274204 - 24/08/2014 08:14 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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I got myself banned here a few times because I was talking heresy apparently.
Everyone had plenty to say about how wrong I was ....where are you now guys?
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law

This is about protecting children from paedophiles ....nothing else!
No need to be confused now as Pell has been well exposed by the Royal Commission for the clown that he actually is.

(if you look back you will see I never named this thread ...I don't care what flavour you are ....if you abuse kids you are in my gun)


Edited by Arnoldnut (24/08/2014 08:16)
_________________________
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#1274207 - 24/08/2014 08:36 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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many have been working for years on this ...here's a comment on the Salesians whom I have been attempting to stop from hiding paeds in the pacific islands ...we have had a few extradicted and are jailed in melb now.

Here what the guy who did my legal review had to say...
http://vid1006.photobucket.com/albums/af184/Michael_Scull/Rally2011/ParkinsonIntview.mp4

and our call to parliament for a hearing in victoria..
http://vid1006.photobucket.com/albums/af184/Michael_Scull/Rally2011/AnnBarkerParliamentStepsSm.mp4

I think it important that all parents are aware of the fact paedophilia in the catholic church is far higher incidence than in the general public
and on top of that they have a culture of hiding the same.

What came first we can only wonder.


Edited by Arnoldnut (24/08/2014 08:37)
_________________________
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#1278767 - 04/10/2014 14:36 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ipex Offline
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Registered: 15/05/2014
Posts: 151
Loc: Katoomba, NSW
Pell should be jailed in my opinion. He should be brought back to Australia and put on trial. He personally KNEW of priests and brothers abusing kids and instead of reporting the perpetrators to police, they were just moved on to other churches, parishes and schools. Failure to report serious crimes like this (and in fact, aiding and abetting them) is itself a serious crime. He would not get away with this if it was a secular organisation - say, a workplace, a government department or a public school. The man should be brought to justice, as should many others in the Catholic Church.

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#1278835 - 05/10/2014 13:23 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: ipex]
Cheers Offline
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Registered: 26/05/2007
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Loc: sevenhills nsw
Originally Posted By: ipex
Pell should be jailed in my opinion. He should be brought back to Australia and put on trial. He personally KNEW of priests and brothers abusing kids and instead of reporting the perpetrators to police, they were just moved on to other churches, parishes and schools. Failure to report serious crimes like this (and in fact, aiding and abetting them) is itself a serious crime. He would not get away with this if it was a secular organisation - say, a workplace, a government department or a public school. The man should be brought to justice, as should many others in the Catholic Church.


I'm 100% with you . Totally agree.

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#1278847 - 05/10/2014 15:34 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ipex Offline
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Registered: 15/05/2014
Posts: 151
Loc: Katoomba, NSW
Originally Posted By: Cheers
Originally Posted By: ipex
Pell should be jailed in my opinion. He should be brought back to Australia and put on trial. He personally KNEW of priests and brothers abusing kids and instead of reporting the perpetrators to police, they were just moved on to other churches, parishes and schools. Failure to report serious crimes like this (and in fact, aiding and abetting them) is itself a serious crime. He would not get away with this if it was a secular organisation - say, a workplace, a government department or a public school. The man should be brought to justice, as should many others in the Catholic Church.


I'm 100% with you . Totally agree.


It's great that the tide is turning enough to be able to express these opinions. Just a few years ago, comments like ours would likely get you banned from many/most forums - as I know from experience.

But it hasn't turned far enough and won't have done so until Pell and his cronies are rotting in jail. We just need politicians and lawmakers brave enough to purse justice - most of them are too afraid because Roman Catholics are still a significant (and powerful) minority, and unfortunately votes are deemed more important than justice.

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#1324617 - 14/04/2015 14:09 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
Cheers Offline
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Loc: sevenhills nsw
Originally Posted By: SBT
Both arnoldnut and myself have access to the very documents that the catholic church use as Stanadard Operating Procedures when a case is bought forward by a victim and let me just say that the only thing they are interested in is stopping any investigation from gaining publicity. Usually accomplished by threats of ex communication as a starting point. Not exactly what you would expect to see from a religion that is supposed to care about it's parishoners now is it?

My guess is that Pell will suddenly be promoted to a special post within the Vatican and he will remain there until he dies as a means of stopping him from being investigated. Arnoldnut is right, the church itself is bullet proof but individuals aren't. No religion has any standing above the law.

If a crime has been committed and you played an active part in hidding it then you are guilty of conspiracy to prevert the course of justice no matter what position you hold within any organisation. If you knowingly fail to notify the police of a crime you are also guilty of a similar offence.


I was having a look at these old posts and you are spot on SBT with your guess about Pell being promoted to a special post within the Vatican.

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#1324676 - 15/04/2015 10:18 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ozone doug Offline
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Registered: 06/11/2006
Posts: 1540
Loc: Roma SW QLD Eye to the S Wes...
I was church of england .And was abused when young ,Thought that was normal till later shocked .Guess what my thoughts are now about religion. And i see Dr Creflo A Dollar, Jr. lol what a name hey. Wants his followers to buy him a $63 million dollar Jet so he can spread the word lol.makes my blood boil. mad
Sorry Trav on this one realistic.
_________________________
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https://www.wunderground.com/personal-weather-station/dashboard?ID=IQUEENSL852

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#1324700 - 15/04/2015 12:40 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
teckert Offline
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Registered: 27/05/2001
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Loc: NE suburbs, Adelaide, South Au...
Can we stay on topic please. Thank you.
Comments that are off-topic or offensive will be removed and warnings given.

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#1324709 - 15/04/2015 14:24 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Cheers Offline
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Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
I have been watching the Abuse Inquiry on Sky News multiview over the last 2 days. What can I say except BLOODY HELL. It was BLOODY HELL for the kids who went through this. These priest, nuns, etc who did this are nothing but scum. The priest, nuns, etc who hid this are just as guilty. SCUM!!!!!!!!!!

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#1324712 - 15/04/2015 14:48 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
rain gauge Offline
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Registered: 16/02/2006
Posts: 4336
Loc: Gorokan NSW 4klm West of the ...
And it still goes on
_________________________
Gorokan-YTD-591.7mm

2016 Rainfall-1241.9mm
2015 Rainfall-1568.2mm
2014 Rainfall-1109.1mm


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#1324721 - 15/04/2015 16:17 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: rain gauge]
Cheers Offline
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Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
Originally Posted By: rain gauge
And it still goes on

Yes I know.

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#1324726 - 15/04/2015 16:43 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ozone doug Offline
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Registered: 06/11/2006
Posts: 1540
Loc: Roma SW QLD Eye to the S Wes...
As a kid i though bit odd ,But thought well this must be ok adult church figure no one told me this was wrong .Other kids same thing thought it was normal .Till other kid gets in trouble at school for pulling girls pants down .Then start finding out these things not suppost to happen. Of course dont remember their names and probably dead now .
_________________________
Cheers Doug. 491 Doug/ uhf ch50 and ch40 When severe weather
BOM Stormspotter G0388 Roma S W Queensland Formerly Redcliffe.
https://www.wunderground.com/personal-weather-station/dashboard?ID=IQUEENSL852

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#1326570 - 26/04/2015 11:43 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
need remind everyone that the header isn't exactly correct at all.
the Commission is investigating 'the handling' of child abuse cases.
how it was handled is what is being questioned ...and all 'institutions'.

What is extraordinary is the fact all the different 'institutions' that have been investigated and found wanting have 'replied' to the Commission already.
Except the catholic church.
There is the stinger!!!..... Just have a listen to Commissioner Peter McClellan using the men's health symposium to deliver the message.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD1EDdWplAc

John Menague has a few blogs about this that are worth reading.

meanwhile here's a tune for SBT. Do hope you and your mates have had easy w/end of it ...been thinking of you all ;-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Urtiyp-G6jY
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1326573 - 26/04/2015 12:19 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
there is an earlier thread here on the zone that actually has some involvement in the writing of this book ....the author had followed myself and a few others through recent years which caused his own research and this book is the result.
http://ncronline.org/books/2015/04/book-offers-insight-canon-laws-role-sexual-abuse-crisis

Commissioner Peter McClellan himself recommended, during a public hearing, that every catholic and every parent should read this book.

hastle your library to get an 'e' version ...being it has 680 tags/internet references in it

and just by coincidence Emmett's first comment is right on the money :yes:


Edited by Arnoldnut (26/04/2015 12:22)
_________________________
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#1326577 - 26/04/2015 12:42 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Back in 2004 when I became aware there was three abusers hiding in the pacific islands and not just the one I knew of ....I also became aware of this
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/07/01/1088488097907.html
...and what it represented as far as sorting the ones I knew of from a different Order.

Why I mention this is because the focus of a few days of last weeks hearings were about exactly that ..and the questioning of queenslands DPP and how they preceded was well looked into.

Is why we did it this way in 2004....this rounds up my story back then ...we had to go to the States to get a reporter that 'wasn't scared' ....no [censored] it has been different ;-)
http://watchdogblog.dallasnews.com/2013/...e-charges.html/
and this
http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/images/...ndicies_1-5.pdf

But that all just be a very small part of a much bigger picture .....unfortunately, while ever the church stays 'mum', the train crash will continue.


Edited by Arnoldnut (26/04/2015 12:45)
_________________________
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#1329582 - 19/05/2015 09:16 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
The Royal Commission hearings from Ballarat will be live streamed from 1000hrs AEST today at this link :

http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/860eabc6-e0fc-453a-b9d4-51a89852fede/case-study-28,-may-2015,-ballarat

(you will need cut and paste it for some reason ;-)
Paedophile priest Ridsdale will most likely to called to give 'evidence' .....he was the parish priest here in our CBD of Inglewood.

My own argument is with another teaching Order of priests, whom due to their appearances in a melb courts at the moment, will remain nameless.

these hearings today are looking at Ballarat diocese' "Handling of Abuse Cases" ......and a little earlier history here from 1996 ABC Four Corners program ...this had an injunction of silence on it also.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMsbRR40X4g

or you can find them all here on our web site
http://www.snapaustralia.org/







Edited by Arnoldnut (19/05/2015 09:18)
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#1329709 - 20/05/2015 15:03 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
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Registered: 18/10/2006
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Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
I hope every australian is watching this today ....every parent need now what has been going on ...you don't need be a catholic to be caught in this!

http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/860eabc6-e0fc-453a-b9d4-51a89852fede/case-study-28,-may-2015,-sydney
_________________________
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#1329733 - 20/05/2015 18:36 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ozone doug Offline
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Registered: 06/11/2006
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Loc: Roma SW QLD Eye to the S Wes...
George Pell next Ahhmm ,I know nothing ,I don't recall.I didn't say dont be ridiculous ,I didn't bribe him. Which will it be or all of the above.
Hope the new pope kicks him out .
View from someone that has had the experience of some of these types of people/creeps.Sorry.
_________________________
Cheers Doug. 491 Doug/ uhf ch50 and ch40 When severe weather
BOM Stormspotter G0388 Roma S W Queensland Formerly Redcliffe.
https://www.wunderground.com/personal-weather-station/dashboard?ID=IQUEENSL852

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#1329766 - 21/05/2015 07:55 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Cheers Offline
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Tony Abbott's mate Pell has a lot of questions to answer.
Pell is a creep of the highest order.

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#1329854 - 22/05/2015 11:11 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
GDL Offline
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Registered: 17/02/2008
Posts: 630
Loc: Bowen Mountain NSW
Cheers that comment is ofensive please take it down .

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#1329856 - 22/05/2015 11:17 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Cheers Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
Tony Abbott is Pell's mate.
Pell is a creep.
Which part is offensive ?


Edited by Cheers (22/05/2015 11:17)

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#1329867 - 22/05/2015 13:06 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
samboz Offline
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Registered: 16/11/2014
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Loc: Between Maffra & the Mountains...
You are inferring that the PM has knowingly got a pedophile mate and condones the behaviour, that's whats wrong with your comment.

Maybe I've got it wrong, care to enlighten ?

Pretty cheap shot at our PM to be candid, why mention TA at all ?

I agree with GDL.

As far as the RC Church goes, it's a bldy disgrace and most other organisations worldwide would have been disenfranchised and sent to coventry by now.

The cover ups (and blind eyes turned) are undeniable by any standard and the Royal Commission hearing at Ballarat is just another example of what has gone on.

PELL, did someone say no Extradition Treaty between his current address and Aus. ?

Just a coincidence he's there ?
_________________________
Rain total 2016 - 753.5mm.
J-173mm. F-5mm. M-66mm. A-32.5mm. M-24mm
J-88mm. J-143mm. A-17.5mm. S-89.5mm. O-53.5mm.
Nov-61.5mm. Dec - 26mm TOTAL 2016 - 779.5MM
Rain 2017. Jan-9.5mm. Feb-23mm. March-49mm
April-40mm. May-9mm to 0900 29th.

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#1329889 - 22/05/2015 18:24 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Cheers Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
Tony Abbott is Pell's mate and is well known.
Tony Abbott has said he won't make Pell come back to Australia to front the Royal Commission.
A bit suspect don't you think.
Offensive it's not.

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#1329892 - 22/05/2015 18:43 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ozone doug Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 06/11/2006
Posts: 1540
Loc: Roma SW QLD Eye to the S Wes...
Pell said he would front the commission.They won't go hard on him till he arrives.Or he may not turn up i would say .Just my 2c.
_________________________
Cheers Doug. 491 Doug/ uhf ch50 and ch40 When severe weather
BOM Stormspotter G0388 Roma S W Queensland Formerly Redcliffe.
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#1329895 - 22/05/2015 20:11 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
samboz Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 16/11/2014
Posts: 1484
Loc: Between Maffra & the Mountains...
Since when can the Prime Minister "make" or otherwise force a person overseas do anything, due process of law must take place - Democracies and all that !

PELL, regardless of our opinion of him, would have to be extradited to face a legal process in Australia by that proper process of law. I am not aware if the Royal Commission can apply for extradition of PELL to appear for interview by them.

Lacking a Prima Facie case against him its seem doubtful that extradition is applicable.

What could the P.M. do to "force" Pell to return to Aus Cheers, always interested to learn what legal process is applicable.

This is interesting -

"By specifying the crimes, Dalla Torre said, the new Vatican laws make it much easier for the Vatican to cooperate with other governments and even extradite a person who committed the crime elsewhere, but was trying to hide in the Vatican"

Further reading at -

http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1302997.htm
_________________________
Rain total 2016 - 753.5mm.
J-173mm. F-5mm. M-66mm. A-32.5mm. M-24mm
J-88mm. J-143mm. A-17.5mm. S-89.5mm. O-53.5mm.
Nov-61.5mm. Dec - 26mm TOTAL 2016 - 779.5MM
Rain 2017. Jan-9.5mm. Feb-23mm. March-49mm
April-40mm. May-9mm to 0900 29th.

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#1329896 - 22/05/2015 20:14 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: ozone doug]
samboz Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 16/11/2014
Posts: 1484
Loc: Between Maffra & the Mountains...
Originally Posted By: ozone doug
Pell said he would front the commission.They won't go hard on him till he arrives.Or he may not turn up i would say .Just my 2c.


If he comes back voluntarily it could only be hoped that he gets a good going over and enough evidence is educed to charge him with criminal offences.

Interesting times ahead.
_________________________
Rain total 2016 - 753.5mm.
J-173mm. F-5mm. M-66mm. A-32.5mm. M-24mm
J-88mm. J-143mm. A-17.5mm. S-89.5mm. O-53.5mm.
Nov-61.5mm. Dec - 26mm TOTAL 2016 - 779.5MM
Rain 2017. Jan-9.5mm. Feb-23mm. March-49mm
April-40mm. May-9mm to 0900 29th.

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#1329897 - 22/05/2015 20:53 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Brett Guy Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 4840
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
I dont know too much about our extradition treaties but i highly doubt the Vatican will allow a highly placed member be extradited for serious matters. Pell will be staying right where he is methinks.

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#1329904 - 23/05/2015 06:33 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
> ""What could the P.M. do to "force" Pell to return to Aus Cheers, always interested to learn what legal process is applicable.

a friend who wrote a book about my case and the canon law/church laws used around it to avoid prosecution (Potiphars Wife ..hiding Sex abuse in the cathiolic church)

he wrote an outline of what is possible with George Pell


""""I think it highly unlikely that George Pell will be charged with any criminal offence because there was no criminal offence of concealing a crime after 1981. That was the year misprision of felony was abolished in Victoria. Prior to 1981, it was a criminal offence to conceal a felony - and child sexual abuse was always a felony.

I should also add that the mandatory welfare reporting of children at risk were introduced into Victoria in the 1990s, but clergy were never included as mandated reporters.

So, it doesn't matter how much George knew after 1981, he cannot be criminally liable for failing to report.

Pell was on the Consultors Committee for the Ballarat Diocese from about July 1977, or at least that seems to have been the earliest in which he attended meetings. The meetings he did attend from 1977 to 1981 did mention Ridsdale a couple of times, but only in terms of his be appointed to different parishes. There is nothing in the minutes about complaints against him or the reason for the move.

The "bribe" conversation with David Ridsdale was in 1993, well after the abolition of misprision of felony. The interesting thing is when Victoria abolished misprision of felony in 1981, it did not follow NSW and create a statutory offence in similar terms. But it did create an offence of concealment in return for a benefit.

S.326(1) Crimes Act 1958 provides:
(

1) Where a person has committed a serious indictable offence, any other person who, knowing or believing that the offence, or some other serious indictable offence, has been committed and that he has information which might be of material assistance in securing the prosecution or conviction of an offender for it, accepts any benefit for not disclosing that information shall be guilty of a summary offence and liable to level 8 imprisonment (1 year maximum).

If David Ridsdale had accepted a bribe in return for his silence, he could have been charged under S.326.

There may well be other provisions under the Victorian Crimes Act, such as attempting to pervert the course of justice where the offeror of the bribe might be charged.

The difficulty is, however, that a jury has to be satisfied beyond reasonable doubt that the conversation took place, and it is difficult to obtain such a conviction where there is one person's word against another's.

Be that as it may, the worst part of any criminal conviction is the destruction of one's reputation, and I am sure that readers can make up their own minds as to what has happened to George's.""


You see guys ....until we changed the law in Victoria recent there was no existing laws to make you dob in a paedophile.
The australian Legal system felt australians didn't need to be made to dob in a paedophile ...and so had removed the misprison laws way back.

you need read the book heheheheeeee ...is about Canon Law and Australian Law ...and how the two were used to hide paedophiles and leave them unreported.

excuses the long winded but not easy to explain.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1329905 - 23/05/2015 06:44 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
or just read the earlier thread here on the Zone....

http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law

Dilbert got rubbed out in an earlier life/though Arnoldnut has survived the scribes .....church works in mysterious ways :-D

If anyone watched the Drum last night they would know the game has changed completely......


Edited by Arnoldnut (23/05/2015 06:52)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1329907 - 23/05/2015 07:05 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
If you read back through that therad i posted you will find some about one priest we needed to extradict from the Vatican.
he be standing in the court on melb waiting a decision.
there is an injuction out to stop publication ....but
I'll let loose after the court releases us from silence.

In that earlier thread someone here said their mums a judge ...maybe I can send her a book on how we managed it ;-) .....she was right about aussie law :yes: and why it took 15 years.

some things take a little longer than others :yes: ...and these guys are very 'special' ...not any more!

clue here....
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spe/2004/runawaypriests/priests/


Edited by Arnoldnut (23/05/2015 07:14)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1329908 - 23/05/2015 07:20 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
of course please know that they be powerful enough that if you say the wrong thing here about certain priests ....whether you are aware of the injunction or not ....you will be locked up.

THAT is how they have gotten away with it so long :yes: ...using our aussie laws to protect themselves...while abiding my their own Canon Law and changing it to suit the occasion ...as they did in 2001


everybody is [censored] scared of them ...and so for the forums sake ..No names of groups or members ....they be protected at the moment.

Now you are all chicken ....and I can't blame you :-D

Is not about religion or politics ...is about Aussie law being inadequate against Canon Law and how wer in Victoria have had to change our laws to protect us against this Canon Law.
same deal we have taken to the United Nations ...they be demanding a respnse from the Vatican also.


Edited by Arnoldnut (23/05/2015 07:30)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1329917 - 23/05/2015 10:02 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
samboz Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 16/11/2014
Posts: 1484
Loc: Between Maffra & the Mountains...
Must read up on the prev. threads arnoldnut, I have no doubt as to the fact that crooks hide behind Aus. laws, happens every day.

Re comments - compared to some blogs/forums/media reports the posts I've read here are pretty tame, however I get your point.

Hang in there arnoldnut (& others), all Australians support and admire the courage shown to give evidence and make "them" answer.
_________________________
Rain total 2016 - 753.5mm.
J-173mm. F-5mm. M-66mm. A-32.5mm. M-24mm
J-88mm. J-143mm. A-17.5mm. S-89.5mm. O-53.5mm.
Nov-61.5mm. Dec - 26mm TOTAL 2016 - 779.5MM
Rain 2017. Jan-9.5mm. Feb-23mm. March-49mm
April-40mm. May-9mm to 0900 29th.

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#1329924 - 23/05/2015 12:04 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
rain gauge Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 16/02/2006
Posts: 4336
Loc: Gorokan NSW 4klm West of the ...
If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor.




Desmond Tutu
_________________________
Gorokan-YTD-591.7mm

2016 Rainfall-1241.9mm
2015 Rainfall-1568.2mm
2014 Rainfall-1109.1mm


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#1329932 - 23/05/2015 13:50 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Thanks samboz and all, trust me when I say I've spent a million buck chasing these guys ....but my family is still here.
Other haven't been as fortunate. ....these guys be arseholes I can tell you.

but no point in going there ....was the best million I've ever spent :-D trust me...it costs others far more than just money.

I consider myself lucky being I found a surgeon who fixed me bum ...gratus too.
These are the things the public needs know about how [censored] up these guys are.
I'm not ashamed ...kick their %$%#%ing %$#^'s in if they come near me or my family again
But meanwhile it seems we be getting the message out there as to what has been going on.

here's a story about our local priest ..3 years before i brought my family here
....when I found out what was going on here ....on top of the bllody school I went to ....I thought enough was enough.
Excuse my nutz on this but is the only way to put a stop to it.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3092866/Australia-s-wo
rst-pedophile-priest-admits-control-went-haywire-abusing-altar-boys.html
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1330192 - 27/05/2015 10:26 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Royal Commission interviewing paedophile Father gerald ridsdale live on line now

http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/860eabc6-e0fc-453a-b9d4-51a89852fede/case-study-28,-may-2015,-sydney


Edited by Arnoldnut (27/05/2015 10:27)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1330267 - 28/05/2015 11:35 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Royal Commission has just stopped for a short break .....they needed it after hearing all the horse [censored] from Ridsdale. Gave me a little nausea and I had to lie down myself as the [censored] flowed from his mouth. You can watch it on this tag but make sure you have a bucket handy!

and before everyone jumps up and down and maybe deletes this I would consider the fact that the Royal Commission is actually on the same page as myself ..they know they have a hostile witness ..watch and see
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/860eabc6-e0fc-453a-b9d4-51a89852fede/case-study-28,-may-2015,-sydney
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1330626 - 01/06/2015 09:25 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Cheers Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 26/05/2007
Posts: 1049
Loc: sevenhills nsw
Originally Posted By: Cheers
Tony Abbott's mate Pell has a lot of questions to answer.
Pell is a creep of the highest order.

Pell is in big trouble now with the Pope's personally picked commissioner into child abuse saying that Pell should get his arse back to Australia to answer a lot of questions. The commissioner had a lot to say about Pell on 60 minutes last night.I wonder if Tony Abbott is still going to support (his mate) Pell now like he did last week. ONE DAY A ROOSTER, NEXT DAY A FEATHER DUSTER.

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#1335468 - 16/07/2015 14:46 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
A paedophile, a priest, a teacher and a criminal walk into a bar and he orders a drink.
_________________________
202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
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#1337010 - 31/07/2015 11:43 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: SBT]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Originally Posted By: SBT
A paedophile, a priest, a teacher and a criminal walk into a bar and he orders a drink.


Yep SBT, still makes me angry too! Barbara Dorris, you may recall us arguing with her :-) sent me a heads up about the new 'Spotlight' movie.

and the rest is just churning away, ....pell and mulkearn and a few others will be here before the beak before xmas.
getting a little easier these days ...doubt if that joke would have been allowed a few years back.
There is some progress there ...unfortunately.

Certain have had their chance to come clean ...but if they insist of being dragged by the ankles ..what can you do?
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1337011 - 31/07/2015 11:55 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
meant to say....
if anyone is following the Mulkearn/Pell/Ballaraat part of the Royal Comish hearings, I have the 1996 Four Corners program 'Twice Betrayed' listed r/h bottom of page here http://www.snapaustralia.org/

essential background ....this is the program that was banned for a while in Vic ...on what grounds you wonder.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1340352 - 07/09/2015 10:44 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
didn't know where to put this ...was tempted to put it in 'politics' ..or many other topics over the years....
I feel this poem applied to many things ....this is a fathers day poem written for grandfathers I think.
by a John Churchman (we all have google)

My Religion...

I lived through
a period of
grief and anger
at the loss of the religion
of my youth.

My youthful religion
provided the rites, rituals, and activities
which gave me
a sense of purpose, meaning.
belonging, and identity.

Late in life,
when I could honestly and maturely
examine my religion,
I was full of anger
at what I thought its careerist administrators had done
to ruin/corrupt it.

I grieved the loss
of the religion of my youth.

I then discovered that
my anger was misdirected,
my grief misunderstood.

No one corrupted,
No one destroyed
the religion of my youth.
It never really existed
or if it did,
it existed only in my youthful mind.

The failings in it that I now see,
the abuse, discrimination, manipulation, exclusiveness, corruption, tyranny, etc.,
have always existed.
In my immaturity,
I saw them not.

I was really grieving
the loss of my own innocence,
I was angry
about the loss of my own misconceptions.

Now,
I simply grieve for those adults
who still live in a childish religion of their youth,
unreal though it is,
and I am angry
at the clergy
who keep them trapped there,
for their own benefit.

Love, John
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1340545 - 10/09/2015 13:21 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
here is an example of 'how they got away with it for so many years ....8 victims and 8 seperate trials (all in ignorance of each other)

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/law-ord...2-1227502872729

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/paedop...828-gja22d.html

this is one of the laws that are being reconsidered by the Royal Commission .....Fox be one of the three paed priests that pressure from victims got back from overseas .....'got him to jail anyway.

Now further to a conversation we were having in 2006 here http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law
This guy Tapsell wrote a book about it 'Potiphars Wife'
while here he speaks on another book ...same drill but more simply explained. (though none of it is)
http://www.globalpulsemagazine.com/news/defending-the-indefensible/1186

the book goes through this case of the three hiding in the islands and the vatican.....I'm still wondering if he be 'wondering' ;-)



Edited by Arnoldnut (10/09/2015 13:23)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1340564 - 10/09/2015 20:04 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
Brett Guy Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 4840
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
Originally Posted By: Arnoldnut
here is an example of 'how they got away with it for so many years ....8 victims and 8 seperate trials (all in ignorance of each other)

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/law-ord...2-1227502872729

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/paedop...828-gja22d.html

this is one of the laws that are being reconsidered by the Royal Commission .....Fox be one of the three paed priests that pressure from victims got back from overseas .....'got him to jail anyway.

Now further to a conversation we were having in 2006 here http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law
This guy Tapsell wrote a book about it 'Potiphars Wife'
while here he speaks on another book ...same drill but more simply explained. (though none of it is)
http://www.globalpulsemagazine.com/news/defending-the-indefensible/1186

the book goes through this case of the three hiding in the islands and the vatican.....I'm still wondering if he be 'wondering' ;-)



Thats pretty standard though. Not just in regards to the church. Remember the Skaff brothers? Several different trials all separate

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#1340568 - 11/09/2015 01:26 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Too true Brett, but what the Royal Comish has found is the leaders knew they had child abusers and moved them around regardless.

Victoria has already reinstated our misprison law as will other states follow suit.
all too hard to explain here. Royal Comish released this today
http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov...tralia-conferen

while the case I was banging on about is explained here
http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3633089.htm

Those that are interested would have followed Bishop Geoffrey Robinson's testimony in the Comish the other day. He understands the problem though some of the congregations are playing hard ball still.

just have to wait and see what comes out in the wash ...while off yet though.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1365943 - 16/02/2016 20:11 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ColdFront Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/06/2008
Posts: 17197
Loc: Wide Bay..Near the beach
http://dailyreview.com.au/tim-minchin-pleads-come-home-cardinal-pell-in-new-charity-single/37057

I really enjoyed this song. No surprises that Steve Price finds it offensive being so far up Abbott's tree.
_________________________
“ Trump thinks an impeachment involves fruit

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#1365974 - 17/02/2016 07:37 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Thanks ColdFront,
I was about to drop this here but you beat me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtHOmforqxk

The lads in ballarat started this crowd funding and low and behold the public got behind them and now a few are off to bash on the vaticans door.
https://www.gofundme.com/sendballarattorome
Trust me when I say all those involved really needed to know where the public stood about this ...being we have no yardstick.

Waking to $75000 in the kitty put that worry out of survivors minds.

Please know that every little penny will be well used to raise awareness of their secret Catholic Canon Laws which instruct bishops to keep silent about abuser clergy. there is a book about how these church laws are used in present day cases ...how else would all these bishops work in such unison all over the world without these Canon Law instructions .....stands to reason.
A few survivors who have questions unanswered by Pell will be going ....and some parents (self funded) Watch this space .....many survivors gathering in ballarat starting monday ......and all self funded I can assure you.





Edited by Arnoldnut (17/02/2016 07:38)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1365977 - 17/02/2016 08:01 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
ColdFront Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/06/2008
Posts: 17197
Loc: Wide Bay..Near the beach
You're welcome. I have a suspicion this song may go viral. Other than a handful in the church responsible for the cover up I think the vast majority of people are sickened by both the abuse and the disgusting wall of silence within the church.
_________________________
“ Trump thinks an impeachment involves fruit

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#1365982 - 17/02/2016 08:48 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
truly was surprised as is a dirty business that no one needs ....but does need be faced up too.

CF, was years ago when i first started my quest against he salesians hiding paeds in samoa (all history now) was actually on the old Weather Channel forum .....some still here hey :wave: about that time a judge/barrister sarted following me around the forums ....he ended up writing a book about Canon Law and how it is the reason behind the cover up .....Potiphars Wife http://www.theherald.com.au/story/231166...claims-in-book/

not asking anyone to read it ...has 480 internet tags/reference ..so buy the E version if you need.

no longer my focus but to give credence, my stories are here .. http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3633089.htm and http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/06/28/3535079.htm or back a little further http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/abus...5658130123.html keep in mind I started to to get these paeds away from teaching samoan kids in Aug 2000

many catholic communities are right behind us and just a for instance, one group headed up by Father Kevin Dillon of Geelong gave me a car when I was fundless and my own car quit .....since back on my feet and passed the car along to a young mum with two at foot. >..that's community!!
as this forum has been to me .....big hi to all, you know who you are. :wave:


Edited by Arnoldnut (17/02/2016 08:52)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1366497 - 20/02/2016 05:06 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1366504 - 20/02/2016 08:07 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Brett Guy Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 4840
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
As much as i wouldn't trust pell as far as i could kick him this does seem a little suss. I wouldn't necessarily believe these claims without a lot of evidence. Not just someones word.

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#1366760 - 21/02/2016 00:15 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
subhumn Offline
Cloud Gazer

Registered: 19/11/2012
Posts: 28
Loc: Sydney, Australia
off topic


Edited by Mick10 (21/02/2016 00:43)

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#1366761 - 21/02/2016 00:18 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Arnoldnut]
ColdFront Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/06/2008
Posts: 17197
Loc: Wide Bay..Near the beach
Originally Posted By: Arnoldnut
truly was surprised as is a dirty business that no one needs ....but does need be faced up too.

CF, was years ago when i first started my quest against he salesians hiding paeds in samoa (all history now) was actually on the old Weather Channel forum .....some still here hey :wave: about that time a judge/barrister sarted following me around the forums ....he ended up writing a book about Canon Law and how it is the reason behind the cover up .....Potiphars Wife http://www.theherald.com.au/story/231166...claims-in-book/

not asking anyone to read it ...has 480 internet tags/reference ..so buy the E version if you need.

no longer my focus but to give credence, my stories are here .. http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3633089.htm and http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/06/28/3535079.htm or back a little further http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/abus...5658130123.html keep in mind I started to to get these paeds away from teaching samoan kids in Aug 2000

many catholic communities are right behind us and just a for instance, one group headed up by Father Kevin Dillon of Geelong gave me a car when I was fundless and my own car quit .....since back on my feet and passed the car along to a young mum with two at foot. >..that's community!!
as this forum has been to me .....big hi to all, you know who you are. :wave:


I watched an interview with a guy on the ABC today about Pell. It wa sa real eye opener. He's a gutless grub.
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#1366783 - 21/02/2016 09:07 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
You may be correct CF. Though I was told once that I was 'ontologiocally challenged ..and therefore I couldn't possibly understand!
I was trying to get a few paedophile priests away from kids .....was many years before we put them in a melb prison ...still there ...one was hiding in the vatican

a quote about catholic formation
"priests and male theologians do ..... men really are ontologically superior to women, and that this is a matter of the faith..."

Is misogyny we are dealing with really ...a special variety....and some very bent people :yes:

you can get an ECopy of 'Potiphar's Wife: The Vatican's Secret and Child Sexual Abuse' for less than 10 bucks.
Explains how they have hidden the fact they have canon law in place to silence bishops .....writen by a judge/barrister and ex-seminarian ...heaps of reference tags and why you need the E version.




Edited by Arnoldnut (21/02/2016 09:14)
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#1366833 - 21/02/2016 12:52 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14146
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
If it was the head of News Corp who was doing the same thing as Pell has done, there would be a lynch mob in the streets baying for blood, that there isn't is a testament to how hard the RC church has got it's grip on their parishioners.
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#1366920 - 22/02/2016 05:19 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Strangely SirBT, we have rarely been able to get a news item in o NewsCorp papers. ....and then suddenly the herald-sun does one on George himself ...stinks of se up if you consider all the timing of it ,,,,,,,and who delivered it.
Smoke screen while Archbishop Wilson goes to court on the 3rd for concealing paeds ....worldwide Wilson is the highest ranking catholic on charges at the moment.
heading out for a week in ballarat at the Royal Comish which is a public hearing ....will be televised to the net. Look for the bloke with 'Ontologically Challenged' logo on his shirt.
leave you a tune some may have heard of late
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtHOmforqxk

I will be coming to do some fishing shortly SirBT ...been tangled badly in this crap.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1368619 - 04/03/2016 18:19 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
http://mpegmedia.abc.net.au/rn/podcast/2016/03/rer_20160302_1730.mp3

have a listen to the ABC RN 's interview with Kieran Tapsell concerning the Canon Law associated with todays proceedings.

this is not about bashing catholics ...this is about making our kids safer.
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1368641 - 04/03/2016 19:58 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
should do this also .....the previous audio offered
Kieran Tapsell is a lawyer and former acting judge in New South Wales.
Author of Potiphar's Wife, Kieran Tapsell, interviewed by Andrew West on Radio National's Religion and Ethics Report. Originally broadcast on 2nd March 2016. Alternatively you can listen at:
www .abc.net.au/radionational/programs/religionandethicsreport
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1390634 - 18/10/2016 08:43 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
" The Smother" - cops shielded Catholic monster

In the paper copy of yesterday's Weekend Australian there was reference to a 3 part podcast series starting Monday in The Australian.

It was in an item about Pell seeking advice from a prominent criminal QC.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national...bb470a469d0d542

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/in-depth...74ae9907b2da2d4

or here if you can't get pass the paywall and wish to hear the PodCast
https://www.whooshkaa.com/episode?id=88224


Edited by Arnoldnut (18/10/2016 08:46)
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1393871 - 16/11/2016 11:51 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
Case Study 42, August and November 2016, Newcastle and Sydney - Live hearing

http://childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/2e6839f5-220a-4e3d-b92c-461bbe74ad34/case-study-42,-august-and-november-2016,-newcastle-and-sydney

and some may wonder why on the Zone
some history....I was dilbert in those days
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189723/Re_Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law
_________________________
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.”

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#1408952 - 20/02/2017 23:17 Re: Royal Commission Catholic Church [Re: Cheers]
Arnoldnut Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 18/10/2006
Posts: 1548
Loc: Arnold, NthWest Vic
down to the last weeks Royal Commission into the catholic church's handling of their paedophile problem and seems all they can talk about this last week is Canon Law and the part it play.

You can watch it tomorrow on this tag ..

http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/261be84b-bec0-4440-b294-57d3e7de1234/case-study-50,-february-2017,-sydney

bit of history here from 2006 ....I believe Wondering (one of the blokes who chimed in here in this thread ....gave witness last week to the Commission in a public hearing.

Canon Law vs Australian Law
http://forum.weatherzone.com.au/ubbthreads.php/topics/189700/Canon_Law_vs_Australian_Law


Edited by Arnoldnut (20/02/2017 23:18)
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