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#1400851 - 06/01/2017 16:37 Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today
wrxflame Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 18/06/2007
Posts: 85
Loc: Torrensville SA
Saw this awesome cloud that a quick search shows as a wave cloud. Seen today about half way into the flight.

url=https://flic.kr/p/QXC9pz][/url]Untitled by Andrew,

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#1400858 - 06/01/2017 17:04 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
Chris #3 Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 08/02/2009
Posts: 1884
Loc: Semaphore SA
Whoa nice catch wrx.

Not a morning glory? Think they're lower to the ground and bigger (hard to get scale from your picture though)

So half way between Perth -> Adel? What time did you take off? Want to see if I can hunt it down.

edit: Lol not hard to find. Thought it was going to be way smaller.


Edited by Chris #3 (06/01/2017 17:09)
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#1400859 - 06/01/2017 17:07 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
wrxflame Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 18/06/2007
Posts: 85
Loc: Torrensville SA
Thanks Chris, feel fortunate to have witnessed it and will post a couple more soon just having trouble posting images using iPad and phone only.

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#1400863 - 06/01/2017 17:30 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
Chris #3 Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 08/02/2009
Posts: 1884
Loc: Semaphore SA
No probs.

Here it is from visible sat -


Edited by Chris #3 (06/01/2017 17:30)
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#1400875 - 06/01/2017 18:45 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
betsuin Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 07/04/2010
Posts: 539
Loc: Magill, Adelaide
Nice one! That's really impressive especially as the sat pic is kind of, oh yeah, but then the "close up" really shows what it is.

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#1400916 - 06/01/2017 22:23 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
wrxflame Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 18/06/2007
Posts: 85
Loc: Torrensville SA
Thanks for the sat pic that's very cool also and shows where the pictures were taken, give or take. Oh and apologies for the large image file in the first post, tried to edit but no option to do so.

This might give some scale as I included the wing and engine.

l enjoying looking back at the images.

Untitled by Andrew, on Flickr


Edited by wrxflame (06/01/2017 22:28)

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#1401109 - 08/01/2017 11:58 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
ThD Ht Offline
Weatherzone ratbag

Registered: 02/03/2002
Posts: 3917
Loc: Reynella, S.A.
that second pic you posted is an absolute ball tearer Wrx,
i take a special interest in more unusual cloud formations,
there's some really crazy stuff out there at times, as you
can see from my last coupla chases, there's a lot more to
stormchasing than just storm cells and lightning.
if i see something unusual i'll hit the brakes, shoot first
and ask questions later.
there could be a coupla' things going on there, one is a
harmonic atmospheric oscillation resulting from a very
stable layer of air interacting over another travelling
at a different speed, a bit like the horrible corrugations
that can occurr on a dirt road as a result of the harmonic
oscillation of a vehicle wheel over it. the resulting
change in altitude/temp./pressure can cause an almost
saturated parcel of air to condense as it reaches a peak
and then evaporate as it drops back down from the resulting
wave formation.
the other is that it may be the peaks of a Kelvin-Helmholtz
wave which is similsr to but different to the above. where
as the above is a result of harmonic oscillation of the
layer of air a K-H wave is as a direct result of shear
between two layers of atmosphere where the boundary layer
is narrow and defined, the factors that cause condensation
at the peaks of a K-H wave are the same as the harmonic
oscillation. even though K-H waves require narrow and well
defined paramaters for things to happen right harmonic
oscillation requires far narrower paramaters for things to
happen.

some of the older forum members will remember the pic below,
it was taken around '00-'02 on my canon film camera, the pic
is a scan of the print i got back, that's why quality is
more crap than usual for me. after i posted it and found out
what it was it really caught my interest and imagination, i
did a lot of study on atmospheric cloud waves, why and how
they occur. once i stood up and took notice of these
occurrences i was surprised at how often K-H waves actually
happen, and it's not just what you see like in the pic below,
imgine you are under water looking up at breaking surf, many
times i've looked up at the clouds and seen the exact same
thing and when i suddenly realised what i was looking at it
was a well defined "well bugger me dead....so that's what's
happening and why" moment.
taken south of naracoorte looking sw


oh and just one other little adjunct to a comment of
yours about not being able to edit your oversize pic.
that 'timed' edit feature is actually down to me believe
it or not.
many moons ago when the WZ forum was the hot place to be
heard and not seen there was no edit timeout, you could
edit your post whenever you wanted even weeks down the
track but then the weatherzone ratbag stepped in and took
the piss out of some chicky babe who posted a very vague
pic what she was trying to call a funnell embedded in what
was a very homogeneous cloud base, others were questioning
the pic with due democracy and decorum but good l mr.
bull in a china shop with the diplomatic decorum of
Kim Jong-un laid it on thicker than slab of airport tarmac.
consequently said chicky babe spat the dummy and went on a
massive hissy fit and deleted all of her posts in that
particular thread leaving everyone else that posted with
their pants well and truly down around their ankles.
not long after that admin. introduced the timed edit feature.
so sorry about that Wrx and other trendsetters, that preview
button and i are really good friends when it comes to making
sure my post appears exactly the way i want it to appear
before submitting.

TH

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#1401210 - 09/01/2017 11:26 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
wrxflame Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 18/06/2007
Posts: 85
Loc: Torrensville SA
I'm glad you thought the pic was a beauty as I was wondering if it was just me thinking it was amazing and I was lucky to witness it. Seeing and capturing these images gives me the same feeling of luck and awe as to when I managed to see and capture pictures of a well formed Roll Cloud at Wallaroo back in 2009. Even more pleased that you have explained, with lots of detail and in layman's terms, how it might have been formed. I have done some reading now and understand your comments more this morning than when I first read the post yesterday. I also read about atmospheric lee waves and again your post provides insight.

My gut feel is they are not K-H waves as they don't appear to have that rolling fluid look like your excellent picture. More inclined towards the atmospheric waves you describe.

Good to know why the limit on editing and I'll remember that for next time. #previewbuttonisking

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#1401221 - 09/01/2017 13:17 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
ThD Ht Offline
Weatherzone ratbag

Registered: 02/03/2002
Posts: 3917
Loc: Reynella, S.A.
yer good for you Wrx,
i could have just let that post go like most others but you
took the time to take the pic and post it so......
i really enjoy grabbing something like that and giving
people something something to read about and hopefully
they further their knowledge by reading further.
the K-H effect can be seen like in your pic because you
may not be seeing the whole wave like in my pic, just the
very crest of the wave as it passes through the LCL (Lifted
Condensation Level).
having said that it is also interesting to note that on
the close up pic (1st one) you can see a place where even
the top part of the trough of the wave is just above the LCL.
this shows it's not a full on breaker but more of a sine wave.
having thought about it more i would say the shear occurring
here has a less defined boundary layer and also less speed
and more stable, causing a rippling effect similar to what
one might see on the bottom of the ocean, if the shear was
greater then it would go from a sine wave to breakers.
without going back and doing a lot of reading, i think all
of the above comes really under the K-H effect of boundary
layer fluid shear causing wave like distortion.

special thanks to Teckert for fixing my dud pic link.

TH
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#1401233 - 09/01/2017 14:33 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
red earth Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 21/12/2007
Posts: 361
Loc: Lockleys, Adelaide
What an interesting weather topic you WZers have come up with here. The 2nd photo from wrx with the wing and engine for scale, TH's learned dissertations and the sat pic from Chris #3 prove once again, that for me WZ is the go to for helping to understand the weather.

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#1401243 - 09/01/2017 15:49 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
ozone doug Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 06/11/2006
Posts: 1588
Loc: Roma SW QLD Eye to the West...
Nice work guys and tracking the sat picture too.
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#1401259 - 09/01/2017 17:27 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
JohnC Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 03/02/2011
Posts: 155
Loc: Adelaide, South Australia

Virgin Australia just posted some more pics from a passenger https://www.facebook.com/virginaustralia/posts/10154070732356990
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#1401359 - 10/01/2017 12:56 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
wrxflame Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 18/06/2007
Posts: 85
Loc: Torrensville SA
Hi John, I was hoping my pic would be the one to go viral haha....not to be as #virginaustralia posted that person pic and not mine from the Instagram tags.

That thread has gone crazy with chemtrails and other types of conspiracy crap so in some ways I'm glad not to be associated.

Much rather the sensible and interesting discussions in here.

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#1401370 - 10/01/2017 14:00 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
Markus Online   content
Weatherzone Moderator

Registered: 02/12/2010
Posts: 2088
Loc: Clare, SA
Incredible stuff wrxflame! What a rare and lucky moment you have captured!

Agree re the chemtrails, it is astonishing how many people believe that conspiracy with all the evidence in contrary to their beliefs.
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#1401372 - 10/01/2017 14:10 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
wrxflame Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 18/06/2007
Posts: 85
Loc: Torrensville SA
I went looking for an archive sat pic and managed to find this from a NASA site.

Hi Res Sat Image Jan 6 2017 by Andrew, on Flickr

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#1401373 - 10/01/2017 14:10 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
ThD Ht Offline
Weatherzone ratbag

Registered: 02/03/2002
Posts: 3917
Loc: Reynella, S.A.
oh wow Wrx, that really shows it off, well done,
i bet if you look hard enuff you might even see your plane. poke

Originally Posted By: wrxflame

That thread has gone crazy with chemtrails and other
types of conspiracy crap so in some ways I'm glad not
to be associated.


yer there certainly are more then the planets fair
share of brain dead far quits out there, that's why i
don't even bother going to places like that, even
for a look.

Originally Posted By: wrxflame

Much rather the sensible and interesting discussions in here.


now that's pushing the envelope a bit.
whilst sticking to the rules of engagement, science and
logic i try to keep sensibilities and decorum to a minimum.

and while i'm here posting to all those of you who see
something wierd or different or just don't know what
you're looking at take a pic of it an post it up.
you don't have to start a new thread just put it in the
day to day thread.

TH

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#1401494 - 11/01/2017 10:49 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
JohnC Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 03/02/2011
Posts: 155
Loc: Adelaide, South Australia
Some key posts of the conspiracy theory nuts. *sigh* http://www.businessinsider.com.au/check-...ng-crazy-2017-1
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#1401505 - 11/01/2017 11:56 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
ThD Ht Offline
Weatherzone ratbag

Registered: 02/03/2002
Posts: 3917
Loc: Reynella, S.A.
thanks for that John, after what i said previous i had to
have a look, bloody wankers, even the ones that do know
better still don't know what it is they are looking at.
these are the same d'heads that see a ufo and automatically
assume it's extra terrestrial.
U-F-O = Unidentified----Flying----Object
in other words it's something that's flying through the sky
that someone doesn't know what it is.
if you get hit in the back of the head by something flying
through the air and you never find out what it was then
you were hit by a ufo.
the only time you might assume you may have been hit by
a flying saucer is if someone may have hurled a piece of
crockery at you, everything else is a crock.
i digress......
chemtrails???,DELIBERATELY sicken people???, BRAINWASH???
the only chemtrails to be had are the psychedelic
drugs tracking through the blood vessels in these
idiots brains. yer there are chemicals in jet exhaust
as a result of combustion a large amount of which is
water hence the trails but......there's more toxic
chemicals in my farts, a single rip can have people
gagging for fresh air and clear a room in less than
a minute, i'd love to see that happen with the same
volume of jet exhaust.
see what you've started Wrx, this is all your fault. poke

TH
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#1401514 - 11/01/2017 12:56 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
red earth Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 21/12/2007
Posts: 361
Loc: Lockleys, Adelaide
The dear old Advertiser finally caught up with this story on page 5 this morning. Part of the story reads: "Neil Bennet from the WA BOM said they were wave clouds, caused when air hit an obstruction such as a mountain, forcing the air over it. It's like skipping a stone on water, he said."

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#1401580 - 11/01/2017 20:22 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: red earth]
betsuin Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 07/04/2010
Posts: 539
Loc: Magill, Adelaide
Originally Posted By: red earth
"wave clouds, caused when air hit an obstruction such as a mountain, forcing the air over it."


Hmm, not many mountains around there - maybe the Stirling Range or the cliffs of The Bight .. if that was the method of formation.

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#1401623 - 12/01/2017 06:18 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
ThD Ht Offline
Weatherzone ratbag

Registered: 02/03/2002
Posts: 3917
Loc: Reynella, S.A.
wrong on both instances, when orographic effect causes that
sort of formation it's immediately over or next to it not
so many miles away. of all people a bom met should know
better than to pass off that as caused by orographics.
more likly the opposite where the lack of orographic
undulation allows something like this to occur between
atmospheric layers. and skipping a stone on water is an
extremely bad analogy for something like that because it
applies to a single object where here we're talking about
two layers of atmosphere that are large scale areas.
the only time i've seen a skipping stone analogy used is
whena meteorite hits the earths atmosphere at such an
acute angle and high speed the atmosphere has enough density
to skip the meteorite back out into space.
i think the analogy of ripples of sand under water is closer.
if that is the actual quote the met gave the the advertiser
then it is quite plain and simply wrong.

TH
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#1401640 - 12/01/2017 09:05 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
teckert Offline
Weatherzone Moderator

Registered: 27/05/2001
Posts: 17477
Loc: NE suburbs, Adelaide, South Au...
One has to presume that the BOM guy 'presumed' this was over land and had no knowledge of the incident when contacted....

Gravity waves: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravity_wave


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#1401666 - 12/01/2017 12:47 Re: Amazing cloud formation - Perth to Adelaide flight today [Re: wrxflame]
ThD Ht Offline
Weatherzone ratbag

Registered: 02/03/2002
Posts: 3917
Loc: Reynella, S.A.
seems there's a lot of assumptions / presumptions going on.
that's a good link, for me gravity waves have been more
associated with my study of cosmology as gravity waves
propogated through space-time, it was mentioned earlier
and i dismissed it as assosiated with the likes of kelvin-rossby
waves on a more global scale.
the explanation is logical and makes sense to me. some
more light reading on the subject is in order.

TH
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