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#1443269 - 02/12/2017 12:18 Re: Australian Politics [Re: RC]
ColdFront Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/06/2008
Posts: 18598
Loc: The Beach.
Originally Posted By: RC
Originally Posted By: ColdFront

So blackmail in other words. I am well aware of the report. Annastacia Palaszczuk said NO to asset sales at the last election.


You forget she also said no deals as well. Then made a deal.


Yeah I get that you're still hurting over that one RC considering Springborg ran to the independents first but was rejected by the conservative Katter party. Speaks volumes about the LNP that the Katters turned them down.

I am glad she broke her word. But then the Liberals said no public servant had anything to fear under them in 2012 and we all know how that played out. The alternative was the LNP and the 2.5 years they did deliver was a catastrophe.
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#1443270 - 02/12/2017 12:18 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
slipperyfish Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 28/11/2011
Posts: 1375
Loc: South Mission Beach QLD
Originally Posted By: ColdFront
Originally Posted By: Mick10


From what i read online, the Cairns highway plan was completed in 2010. Correct me if i am wrong


OK corrected . It won't be completed for many years and extends over Wright's creek to Gordonvale. . Maybe read the report.

Ultimately the comments came from the rubbish that Labor have done nothing the past few years. Maybe seeing as how you love research you can correct those on your side of the fence peddling blatant lies. They have been doing plenty.

Originally Posted By: Mick10
delivering multiple projects up and down the length of the state which should have been fixed decades ago.


You mean when Howard gave all that money away to 16 year olds to encourage them to breed? Or when he gave away all the tax cuts to get re-elected? Yes, $200 BILLION would have built a lot of roads .

Right now, the news of the day is how bad the federal government is, how Nicholls and Newman trashed the LNP in Qld and yet you are still crapping on about Labor. Only the most blinded ,rusted on supporters of the Liberals cannot see that this country is in a state of decay because of them. Labor have not been in government for 4 years so enough of the crap please !!

..and while we are talking about diversions, not a mention from any of you about Michaelia Cash !!


Australias issues are a culmination of successive poor governments since Keating. From that point on they have pandered to the media, corporate business, and fringe minority groups. That is both sides. Both parties put themselves before the people. BOTH SIDES.

Please stop going on about rusted on supporters unless you are willing to take a grinder to yourself.

I understand unquestioning devotion to your lifelong footy team or what have you, but to have the same blind devotion to political parties is just plain dangerous for the country. I literally can't stomach either of them. Pack of crooks and liars the lot of them.

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#1443272 - 02/12/2017 12:25 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Brett Guy Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 5096
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
No wonder our parliment are so proficient at acting like children. It is how many of the citizens behave


Edited by Brett Guy (02/12/2017 12:26)

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#1443273 - 02/12/2017 12:27 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
ColdFront Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/06/2008
Posts: 18598
Loc: The Beach.
See that's where you a wrong Slipperyfish. I am well aware the ALP made / make mistakes but the total denial by pretty much everyone other than Mick10 and yourself regarding the current federal government is some sort of sick joke surely?

Labor are not in government federally but keep getting all the blame put on them, both from the Coalition and their supporters.

..and if you are going to post up that Labor in this state have done nothing the past 3 years then expect to be called out on it because it is absolute rubbish. As I have already said, most voters think it must benefit them directly before the government is seen to be actively progressing the state.

_________________________
"water has c.30x the heat capacity of air. Someone drop the penny please for those fixated on the notion that the atmosphere is the driver ( preferably in 3D)".

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#1443275 - 02/12/2017 12:43 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Mick10 Offline
Weatherzone Moderator

Registered: 02/11/2001
Posts: 25306
Loc: Kirwan, Townsville - NQld.
Originally Posted By: ColdFront
Maybe seeing as how you love research you can correct those on your side of the fence peddling blatant lies. They have been doing plenty.


thats why i try and deal facts without the BS, hence why ive been peeved (once again) and about the level of BS in this thread. think members on both side of the political divide on this thread can stop with the BS and focus on facts at hand, more than happy to continue to debate those.

Originally Posted By: ColdFront

You mean when Howard gave all that money away to 16 year olds to encourage them to breed? Or when he gave away all the tax cuts to get re-elected? Yes, $200 BILLION would have built a lot of roads .


I was not a fan of those tax cuts then, still not now. But i wasn't a fan of $900 cheques either for that matter.

Originally Posted By: ColdFront

Right now, the news of the day is how bad the federal government is


Yet you have no issue with bringing up the Howard government crazy

Originally Posted By: ColdFront

yet you are still crapping on about Labor.


yet you are still crapping on about Howard.

Originally Posted By: ColdFront

Only the most blinded ,rusted on supporters of the Liberals cannot see that this country is in a state of decay because of them. Labor have not been in government for 4 years so enough of the crap please !!

Only the blinded, rusted on supporters of the Labor party cannot see that this country has been in a state of decay since Howard. LNP have not been in power for 3 years in Qld (in fact two terms in 27 years to be exact, but lets still blame the LNP for all the faults of the world) nor has Howard been in Government for 10 years, so enough of the crap please!!

Originally Posted By: ColdFront

..and while we are talking about diversions, not a mention from any of you about Michaelia Cash !!


Im not sure why you are calling it a diversion, you post a link with the a stupid comment. Cash said she cant comment because of legal proceedings, so be it. im not a lawyer. We have had one employee leak to the media from Cashs office, yet Labor had a staff member looking to personal affairs to the NZ government re Joyce and another one in deep doodoo over the Chinese. They just keep lining up dont they?



Originally Posted By: ColdFront
Originally Posted By: Mick10

In regards to NSW, the Federal government introduced a 10% asset sales fund, states that sold assets could invest in this fund and receive 10% back in extra funding. NSW decided to invest, Qld didn't.


So blackmail in other words. I am well aware of the report. Annastacia Palaszczuk said NO to asset sales at the last election.

No, FFS its an investment fund. Something of which the NSW government is using and their state is going great guns. At least the LNP took asset sales to an election, something of which previous Labor governments did not do, or have the balls to do.

Originally Posted By: ColdFront
See that's where you a wrong Slipperyfish. I am well aware the ALP made / make mistakes but the total denial by pretty much everyone other than Mick10 and yourself regarding the current federal government is some sort of sick joke surely?


Did i not post my opinions of the current government only yesterday which you agreed with? I do admit failings where its given thank you very much.
_________________________
Kirwan, Townsville Nth Qld -
June 2018 total - 3.0mm (21mm)
July 2018 total - 14.0mm (15mm)
2018 Yearly total to date - 814.8mm (1107mm)

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#1443280 - 02/12/2017 12:59 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
ColdFront Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/06/2008
Posts: 18598
Loc: The Beach.
Howard gets a mention because he is still very much interferring in the running of the party. I don't think the performance of the Labor party has been stellar in Qld, however it hasn't been destructive either. What's the solution Mick? One Nation? They are worse than both majors so it's a case of picking the best of a bad bunch and for mine that is Labor.

Considering what Gillard was able to get through parliament in a minority government whilst being sniped by Rudd and wrecked by Abbott and Murdoch she did well and history will eventually judge her in a better light than it does now.

Turnbull is NOT the issue in the Liberal party. The far right factions are and they have powerful allies including the fossil fuel lobby groups and Rupert Murdoch who is doing his darndest to split the party .If Turnbull was allowed to run the show this country would have a good chance of getting back on track.

The GG needs to grow some nuts, do his job and throw the Coalition under the bus. Australia is rotting.
_________________________
"water has c.30x the heat capacity of air. Someone drop the penny please for those fixated on the notion that the atmosphere is the driver ( preferably in 3D)".

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#1443281 - 02/12/2017 13:01 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
ColdFront Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/06/2008
Posts: 18598
Loc: The Beach.
...and maybe read my comment again about you and Slipperyfish being the the only ones that DID call out the current government before putting words in my mouth !
_________________________
"water has c.30x the heat capacity of air. Someone drop the penny please for those fixated on the notion that the atmosphere is the driver ( preferably in 3D)".

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#1443282 - 02/12/2017 13:09 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Seira Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 27/08/2003
Posts: 7608
Loc: Adelaide Hills
This is a weather forum first and foremost.
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Knowledge is what to say, wisdom is knowing whether to say it. Understanding connects the two.

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#1443283 - 02/12/2017 13:15 Re: Australian Politics [Re: slipperyfish]
RC Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 29/09/2007
Posts: 2366
Loc: near Rockhampton, Qld
Originally Posted By: slipperyfish

Australias issues are a culmination of successive poor governments since Keating.


Since well before Keating. I would say it started in the 60's with the hippies.

That was the first generation not to have struggled or gone without.

We have now had successive generations that have not had to struggle and it shows.


Edited by RC (02/12/2017 13:15)

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#1443287 - 02/12/2017 13:35 Re: Australian Politics [Re: RC]
Brett Guy Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 5096
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
Originally Posted By: RC
Originally Posted By: slipperyfish

Australias issues are a culmination of successive poor governments since Keating.


Since well before Keating. I would say it started in the 60's with the hippies.

That was the first generation not to have struggled or gone without.

We have now had successive generations that have not had to struggle and it shows.


Good point. The easier people have it the more they tend to complain because they don't understand what real harddship is. Overweight people complaining they can't put food on the table. People with more electronic devices than they need complaining about the cost of electricity. People with a common cold clogging up emergency wards complaining about the quality of health care. It goes on and on. The culture of entitlement is what is killing this country. People believing they have a right to everything they want instead of seeing our great country as a privilege that has to be earnt.

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#1443298 - 02/12/2017 14:06 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Mick10 Offline
Weatherzone Moderator

Registered: 02/11/2001
Posts: 25306
Loc: Kirwan, Townsville - NQld.
Originally Posted By: ColdFront
...and maybe read my comment again about you and Slipperyfish being the the only ones that DID call out the current government before putting words in my mouth !


yeah CF, my apologies, obviously i totally read it wrong, sorry about that.
_________________________
Kirwan, Townsville Nth Qld -
June 2018 total - 3.0mm (21mm)
July 2018 total - 14.0mm (15mm)
2018 Yearly total to date - 814.8mm (1107mm)

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#1443299 - 02/12/2017 14:14 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Mick10 Offline
Weatherzone Moderator

Registered: 02/11/2001
Posts: 25306
Loc: Kirwan, Townsville - NQld.
Originally Posted By: ColdFront

Considering what Gillard was able to get through parliament in a minority government whilst being sniped by Rudd and wrecked by Abbott and Murdoch she did well and history will eventually judge her in a better light than it does now.

No worse than any other government with a hostile senate. Turnbull runs on 1 seat at present and still getting on with delivering what policies he can but it requires serious negotiations with the senate, Hansen more so (aka, ABC wages) to get that supply thru . Gillard had the backing of two independents and katter in supply.

The Lib party is being split by the far right, the likes of Hansen and Bernardi who are hell bent on enforcing far right policies are sadly gaining a popularity which is forcing Liberal far rights to press harder and harder. Labor to this date have been good at quieting its far left factions, but cracks have started to show in labor at state level. Trad, i regard as far left version of Newman had better not grab control of this state.
_________________________
Kirwan, Townsville Nth Qld -
June 2018 total - 3.0mm (21mm)
July 2018 total - 14.0mm (15mm)
2018 Yearly total to date - 814.8mm (1107mm)

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#1443312 - 02/12/2017 14:44 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
slipperyfish Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 28/11/2011
Posts: 1375
Loc: South Mission Beach QLD
Any extremities in politics is dangerous. They only govern for the margins not the majority.

Both extremities on both sides are very good at pointing out deficiencies, but ask them what their plan is to solve it, and listen carefully to what they say.

The best governments have always been centre, whether right or left. Both Turnbull and Rudd should of perfomed better than they have or had. It was the pressure from their extremities, driven by a media devoid of ethics and responsibility, that has created this merry go round style of governments we are experiencing right now.

We, the voter, also need to look at ourselves. We are so quick to pull the trigger, because we are only interested in ourselves and how decisions impact on us personally, whether or not it is better for Australia as a whole is irrelevant it seems.

The whole system is broken from the voters to the politicians.

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#1443316 - 02/12/2017 14:59 Re: Australian Politics [Re: slipperyfish]
Brett Guy Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 5096
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
Originally Posted By: slipperyfish
Any extremities in politics is dangerous. They only govern for the margins not the majority.

Both extremities on both sides are very good at pointing out deficiencies, but ask them what their plan is to solve it, and listen carefully to what they say.

The best governments have always been centre, whether right or left. Both Turnbull and Rudd should of perfomed better than they have or had. It was the pressure from their extremities, driven by a media devoid of ethics and responsibility, that has created this merry go round style of governments we are experiencing right now.

We, the voter, also need to look at ourselves. We are so quick to pull the trigger, because we are only interested in ourselves and how decisions impact on us personally, whether or not it is better for Australia as a whole is irrelevant it seems.

The whole system is broken from the voters to the politicians.


Yep. the extremes have always been the problem and if you look at history it often follows a similar path. The growth of extreme left wing in the form of socialism/communism etc(todays incarnation epitomised by the SJW's have always been followed by a rise in nationalism often leading to extreme fascism. We are currently seeing the same thing across the western world from Aus to the US to Europe. And it almost always leads to conflict. Then when things settle down the pattern repeats because everyone forgets the chain of events and the ideologists start growing in number(due to generational change). I'd like to hear someone offer a solution but I honestly don't know if one exists.

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#1443326 - 02/12/2017 15:25 Re: Australian Politics [Re: slipperyfish]
Seira Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 27/08/2003
Posts: 7608
Loc: Adelaide Hills
Originally Posted By: slipperyfish
We, the voter, also need to look at ourselves. We are so quick to pull the trigger, because we are only interested in ourselves and how decisions impact on us personally, whether or not it is better for Australia as a whole is irrelevant it seems.

The whole system is broken from the voters to the politicians.

We voters have to vote because it is compulsory. This, by law, reflects a virtue of living in this country in that in other countries voting is not necessarily compulsory, therefore the actual outcome of an election may not reflect the decisions of the entire country’s voting population. In that sense voting in Australia is not misleading, because everyone has to do it.

Next, when we vote, we are not voting on certain policy-decision to be made for the benefit of our governance, but rather we are putting our trust and decision-making in the hands of other people. Thus, it is important that when politicians make policy-decisions, that they make them on the basis of what they said they would do when they were voted in. If they don’t, then it is quite understandable why we lose confidence in what they say or claim, and eventually even become disillusioned with the whole process.

So, to counteract the disillusionment, one needs to problem-solve. If that means we questioning the way in which this country – in a fundamental way – is governed, then so be it.
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Knowledge is what to say, wisdom is knowing whether to say it. Understanding connects the two.

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#1443337 - 02/12/2017 16:20 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Markus Offline
Weatherzone Moderator

Registered: 02/12/2010
Posts: 2214
Loc: Clare, SA
The problem with forcing everyone to vote is many people (I'g argue over 50% easily) simply have absolutely no idea what they are voting for, or even who they are voting for.

The number of people after election who joke around having had no real idea who they voted for, which leader belongs where, what their polices are etc is just plain disturbing...voting isn't something millions of people really care about and it is seen as a chore and the outcome reflects that.
Slipperyfish also makes the great point that we are selfish voters, that much is for sure. Offer up some 'tax cuts' and that gets peoples attention, even though they nearly always lose in the long run.

I'd argue compulsory voting is a big reason we keep getting useless governments voted in.

Not that it matters anyway, pollies are above the law and only do what they're told by the rich. Look at America right now, practically not one person wants net neutrality revoked yet the government is doing everything it can year after year to push it through.

Pretty much every 'anti terrorism' law that has been passed in recent years is just a blatant erosion of our privacy, it's already too late at this point to turn the tide which is the saddest part and it will only get much worse. There is very little protection on who has access to metadata which is seriously messed up. And neither party seems to think there is anything wrong with this so voting is useless on this quite frankly, huge issue. Not to mention the creeping from private industry wanting this data, that will be the next 'compromise' for 'safety'.

No-one has faith in politics anymore because pollies only serve themselves and their pockets (via appeasing donors), it's legalised corruption. Sometimes I wish there were a hell so these scummy bastards could get their share of karma, but thats not the world we live in.

I feel like until we solve the fundamental issues with government at the moment all other discussion is pointless. We need to get rid of all donations and we need a fresh government.
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#1443340 - 02/12/2017 16:24 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Kino Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 10/08/2017
Posts: 2677
Loc: Wollongong, NSW, Aus
Get rid of donations - who pays? Us. Not that simple. Representative democracy comes at a cost; none of which anyone wants to pay.

Get rid of compulsory voting - may engage all more rigorously.

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#1443344 - 02/12/2017 16:40 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Markus Offline
Weatherzone Moderator

Registered: 02/12/2010
Posts: 2214
Loc: Clare, SA
Yeah but the ultimate outcomes of donations is corruption.

A good question to ask is what is going to cost more (thinking ahead decades, none of this stupid one term policy crap), a government vying for the interests of corporations at the peril of everyone else, or the tax payer footing the bill.

I think that question can be answered through the NBN screwup alone.

The current process leads to outcomes that are detrimental to the people they are supposed to represent. And it is not just money one needs to consider.
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http://markdawsonphoto.wordpress.com/

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#1443346 - 02/12/2017 16:53 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Brett Guy Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 5096
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
As a taxpayer I would be perfectly happy to pay extra in order to see donations disappear. Corporation, unions, activist groups etc should have no influence in politics. They are a cancer on democracy. And the media. Now that integrity has disappeared from the media something has to be done about them. I am all for a free media but not when it is biased one way or the other. The media must change or they must be dealt with.

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#1443351 - 02/12/2017 17:31 Re: Australian Politics [Re: ColdFront]
Mick10 Offline
Weatherzone Moderator

Registered: 02/11/2001
Posts: 25306
Loc: Kirwan, Townsville - NQld.
i can totally agree on the no donations policies. i think you would be hard pressed to find anyone who would disagree. it certainly is an ugly blight.

the thing i found hard in the recent state election was the return to compulsory preferential voting. i believe the individual voter should choose whether he or she actually wants to give a second preference. Alot of people i spoke to also reflected similar thoughts. One thing that gets up my goat is the parties and media telling people who a candidate/party is preferencing, most people out there still believe that the party or candidate picks the preference when that is just not true. it really is a form of brainwashing. people are shocked when i tell them they dont have to follow the 'how to vote card' or when told they can pick who they want as second, not what the party or candidate says.
_________________________
Kirwan, Townsville Nth Qld -
June 2018 total - 3.0mm (21mm)
July 2018 total - 14.0mm (15mm)
2018 Yearly total to date - 814.8mm (1107mm)

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