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#1007327 - 22/08/2011 10:13 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Sara B]
ROM Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 29/01/2007
Posts: 6628
Thanks Clunky. And my apologies again.
I made two bads in my post.
First I just assumed your definition of "ethical eating" was the same as those of the animal liberators and outfits like PETA who have deliberately set out to destroy the farming of animals of any type and are trying to force onto the society their ideaology that we should not be allowed to keep any animals at all, including pets, let alone kill them for human consumption.
The term "ethical eating" I immediately associated with these extremist organisations.
Your definition of "ethical eating" as I read it is a thoroughly pragmatic and worthy plea for humane and caring respect for animals and their welfare even though they will be used as food. And that for any reasonably thinking person is something that should be fully supported by everybody who has any sort of compassion and a respect for life of any sort.

When using the internet forums one of the traps that we are warned of is the loss of the nuances of vocal speech which in our everyday personal interactions with one another plays a very significant role in ironing out those subtle appreciations that the written word does not and can rarely convey.

And that was my second bad in that my post was poorly constructed so as to make it appear that I was attacking you which was never my intention.
Rather I was ranting on the type of psychology that the animal libbers and the likes of peta who use terms similar to "ethical eating" to try and enforce the concept of their own moral superiority and to convey that they are superior morally and ethically because they are against keeping animals of any sort let alone killing animals for their meat and for human consumption.


And Markus, I think you and I are on pretty much the same wavelength there so thanks for that.

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#1007405 - 22/08/2011 17:33 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: ROM]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
Originally Posted By: ROM
When using the internet forums one of the traps that we are warned of is the loss of the nuances of vocal speech which in our everyday personal interactions with one another plays a very significant role in ironing out those subtle appreciations that the written word does not and can rarely convey.


That is very well articulated and I couldn't agree more.

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#1008630 - 29/08/2011 21:08 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Sara B]
Ree Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 24/01/2010
Posts: 873
Loc: Balnagowan, 20km nth Mackay
My family eat meat 2-3 meals a day, I would very unpopular if I tried to cut it out.

I grew up not knowing much about farming and not much about where my food came from, except a supermarket. 20 years on ....... I am on an acreage and have a free range pig farm that also supplies us with pork, we have some cattle for our beef and I have edible gardens (all my plants are edible or useful in someway). Everything tastes better and the meat is alot tastier and tender.

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#1008685 - 30/08/2011 05:38 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Ree]
Sara B Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 30/01/2011
Posts: 318
Loc: Dugandan
Thats what I am working towards Ree

Though atm I am still buying meat from the supermarket... I'm not going to beat myself up about it. Gotta eat what is available until I establish the right connections and networks to be more discriminating in my choices & despite my best intentions I also eat macca's at times. I guess that we can all have ideals but putting them into practice takes concerted effort and more - the building and working towards self-sufficiency (no doubt with blood sweat & tears along the way).

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#1008753 - 30/08/2011 11:10 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Sara B]
Ree Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 24/01/2010
Posts: 873
Loc: Balnagowan, 20km nth Mackay
Chunky, I eat out and get takeaways I don't think there's anything wrong with that and I don't want my kids to miss out. Imagine how kids at school would react if they hadn't been to Macca's or Hungry Jacks.

It would be sometimes impossible and alot of hard work to be totally self-sufficient but semi self-sufficient is very satisfying. Sometimes (alot lately) the weather doesn't do what it should and different climates restrict what you can grow, I am not going to stop eating something I like for example brussel sprouts because they don't grow here. But in times like cyclones and floods the last few years when supermarkets have been stripped we don't lack anything. It's great to watch my kids for after school snacks head out into my gardens and eat strawberries, bananas, raspberries, mulberries, beans etc. Good luck, PM me if you have any questions.

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#1009917 - 04/09/2011 11:55 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Ree]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14150
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
You might like to find your local Permaculture organisation for some help in becoming self or semi self sufficient guys. These people are realists, not hippy green wayne kerrs who want to turn you into vego's. Sure some of them are (vegans/vegos/whatever) but the majority believe that a complete system can be achived even in an urban backyard. No it isn't easy, there are no instant fixes but it can be done. It is more in tune with living with the land instead of flogging yourself and the land into doing what you want it to do and this includes meat production.

As to methane causing increased green house gases what the 'experts' don't tell you is that methane breaks down over about a 7 (+/- 1 year) year period and doesn't accumulate as they say it does. Sure increasing it can cause problems but they aren't permanent as whatever is produced eventually breaks down.
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#1009964 - 04/09/2011 17:56 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: SBT]
bigwilly Offline
Weatherzone Mod and Photog

Registered: 25/09/2002
Posts: 6543
Loc: Junee - just north of the 'Bid...
A good site to follow is Milkwood

This young couple seem to have their heads screwed on and are pretty pragmatic when it comes to permaculture.
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#1079274 - 21/02/2012 18:53 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: SBT]
kimhumpries Offline
Cloud Gazer

Registered: 02/02/2012
Posts: 15
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Climate change is a human error and we should take any step to stop it.
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#1079284 - 21/02/2012 19:08 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: kimhumpries]
Brett Guy Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 4844
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
What everyone also seems to forget is that the numbers of animals emmiting methane was the same in pre-human history as it is now. It's just that now all thoose animals are on farms and not in the wild. ie methane emmissions no different now than there used to be.

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#1079421 - 21/02/2012 22:17 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Brett Guy]
adon Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 19/08/2004
Posts: 5264
Loc: Not tellin!
Originally Posted By: Brett Guy
What everyone also seems to forget is that the numbers of animals emmiting methane was the same in pre-human history as it is now. It's just that now all thoose animals are on farms and not in the wild. ie methane emmissions no different now than there used to be.


Well maybe you are right but I think that maybe the make up of animals is a little different. Yes there were lots of animals similar to cattle in the past but were they the same in their grazing habits and the breeding may make them more "hard" on their surroundings and their distributions is different(Australia had no sheep/cattle/goats etc.)

But really people eat meat as it has more bang for the buck nutrition wise than other protein sources. Telling people not to eat something that we are designed to eat is silly and really is just a caused that has jumped on the AGW bandwagon in an effort to suck people into turning veg for any reason as long as they give up. Wonder when AGW finally falls over, what will the vegies try to con people with afterwards?

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#1079483 - 22/02/2012 00:29 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: kimhumpries]
SBT Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 07/02/2007
Posts: 14150
Loc: Townsville Dry Tropics
Originally Posted By: kimhumpries
Climate change is a human error and we should take any step to stop it.

Prove it. It shouldn't be all that hard. They have only been investigating this for how long now?
Come on and tell me the science is in, that the IPCC is infallible, that the AGW is a real and explainable action caused by humans, that the IPCC/CRU are entirely correct even though they haven't been caught hundreds of times fudging figures, blackmailing those who oppose them and colluding in hiding what they have discovered. Let them release their raw data, let them show the world that they have a theory that holds up to scutiny and I might, just might agree with you. The only science in cAGW is political science.
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202mm April 2017
Best 156mm 19/5/17
2017 Total 688mm
2016 Total 649mm
2015 Total 375mm
2014 Total 1032mm
2013 Total 715mm







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#1079529 - 22/02/2012 09:38 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Ree]
@_Yasified_shak Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 07/03/2009
Posts: 4040
Loc: El Arish
Originally Posted By: Ree
Chunky, I eat out and get takeaways I don't think there's anything wrong with that and I don't want my kids to miss out. Imagine how kids at school would react if they hadn't been to Macca's or Hungry Jacks.


Missing out? missing out on what? Heart disease? obesity? plastic food? a mass produced toy that will be broken before it gets home? Have a look at the "nutrition" panel on the back of Maccas "food" they are laced with sugar,salt and 1 burger contains more than your daily allowance of fat in 1 serve.
And what is the benefit of eating out? it is in no way cheaper than making a meal yourself, it would cost around $30 to feed a family of 5.

Our older children have not been to Mc Donald's now for about 4 years and our younger children have never been to Mc Donald's and do you think they are missing out? NO they are not, what are your children going to remember you for when they are older? the quality time you spent with them or the times that you took them to "Maccas"
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#1079711 - 22/02/2012 19:59 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: @_Yasified_shak]
Brett Guy Offline
Weatherzone Addict

Registered: 05/10/2010
Posts: 4844
Loc: Bently Park, Cairns
Yeah. I sort of agree with that. Even though I eat it there is nothing good about fast food. Cook em up a great bit of roo on the BBQ and yoou will be doing them a much bigger favour.

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#1079855 - 23/02/2012 07:42 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Brett Guy]
adon Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 19/08/2004
Posts: 5264
Loc: Not tellin!
Yep fast food is easy and lazy. Yep I eat it too on the occasion but I live an our away from the nearest(don't really put the local cafe in the same box cos it is better than that crap) so I dont get tempted unless I am in the bigger towns.

I reckon your into something there Brett, I love roo! Had some the other night in a resturant and LOVED it! less forgiving to cook that lamb/beef though.

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#1079949 - 23/02/2012 12:20 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: adon]
ant Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2002
Posts: 9063
Loc: Overlooking ACT at 848m
Fast food from the big chains is dreadful stuff. It smells to me like it's already half-digested. There was a Southpark episode that made that point rather crudely!

Feeding it to kids on a regular basis is just lazy parenting, it's manufactured food, full of salt, sugar and fat and an amazing array of chemicals to do various things. That "craving" for McDonalds is for the sugar they load it with, yes the hamburgers.

Food from a local takeaway that makes most of its own stuff is a bit different, it's fatty and salty, but for occasional eating it won't do harm. I reckon mincing a bit of roo meat into the hamburger patties would be a great way to go. Good hamburgeries make their own patties.

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#1080281 - 24/02/2012 10:30 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: ant]
Sandfly Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 18/10/2010
Posts: 828
Loc: Rockhampton
Who can afford to eat meat these days anyway? I prob have 2 serves a week, and it's usually cheapest cuts like trotters, neck or chicket legs & wings, saussages. Prime cuts like steak, chicken breast, or lamb is for now only Miners or Corporate Executives
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#1080363 - 24/02/2012 13:55 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Sandfly]
Keith Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 16/12/2001
Posts: 6453
Loc: Kings Langley, NSW
I don't understand the economies of anyone buying meat at supermarkets. In this area it's at least twice as expensive as the butcher.

I have actually started myself to eat less red meat, not out of consideration of animals (which I love nevertheless), but for health reasons. And it saves money! Everything has been given to us for our use and benefit; the issue is whether we do that humanely, not whether we do it at all. I think also that our good health is far more important than that of a herd of cows. For one thing I need it. It's how most of us are made, though some can go without. For that reason it's fine if people want to cut it out completely but they will struggle to find an equivalent iron intake. Better to consult a nutritionist beforehand, I think.

So I am eating it only twice a week or so and have lost 4 kilos in the last 7 weeks.

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#1080413 - 24/02/2012 16:04 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Sandfly]
adon Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 19/08/2004
Posts: 5264
Loc: Not tellin!
Originally Posted By: Sandfly
Who can afford to eat meat these days anyway? I prob have 2 serves a week, and it's usually cheapest cuts like trotters, neck or chicket legs & wings, saussages. Prime cuts like steak, chicken breast, or lamb is for now only Miners or Corporate Executives


Well I would not go that far but yes it is expensive. However when you see the price for meat in the place you buy where ever that may be. Just remember that the person who is growing the stock where the meat is coming from is not getting anywhere near the price for the animal in the sale yards. Today the market price for a lamb was around $4.50/kg carcass weight and for cattle it is around $2/kg. Now the processors rightly say that there is a lot of waste that comes from an animal(guts/bone ect.) but they usually have some market for this stuff so IMO that is not where the costs come in. It is the transport, refriguration and middle men along with huge amounts of red tape that processirs must go through now to comply with health/aminal welfare and god knows what other standards that are chucked in there by big brother/nanny state governments that are at fault here. These regs and rules have shut most of the smaller processors out of the market and now there are only a few processors left doing huge numbers every week. They buy animals from hundreds of km away to keep their numbers up. All coming at extra cost to you the people who eat it.

I grow lamb, so in a way I am insulated from at least some of the prices people are paying. However I still feel that meat, for what it is(highly nutritious food with good bang for the buck bulk wise), is not over priced. Compared to a packet of chips that now are $1.50 for 45g at the cafe in town. This is not even one full potato! All it goes through is a peeler and a slicer and then som hot oil and into a packet( yes there is more but sheesh!) Now the poor bugger growing that spud is probably getting around .20c/kg for potatoes must be scratching his head seeing how a thing he got paid about 5-10c for is now worth $1.50 wouldn't he?

There are so many examples of where food when you consider how it is made for you, is so well overpriced yet meat seems to be to first thing to spring to mind.

While we are on the subject, did anybody notice if the price of bread dropped at all from this time last year? Funny' cos wheat dropped about 30% or more. Same with beer and so many other things that come from grain. The price fell so quickly and by so much that most farmers out here made NOTHING from pretty handy crops. And yet we are told that we are facing a challenge in feeding the world! Well I am simply not planting crops for grain this year and will be just sticking to lambs. At least they are paying their way.

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#1080430 - 24/02/2012 16:39 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: adon]
Sandfly Offline
Weather Freak

Registered: 18/10/2010
Posts: 828
Loc: Rockhampton
Well be need to bring back farmers markets, where local produce can be sold straight to the buying public. The producers will get better prices, the shoppers get better fresher items, and the giant corporations that currently run the supermarkets will fade away as a bad memory.
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#1080701 - 24/02/2012 23:27 Re: Eat Less Meat!!! [Re: Sandfly]
ant Offline
Meteorological Motor Mouth

Registered: 05/10/2002
Posts: 9063
Loc: Overlooking ACT at 848m
I love proper markets. They used to have a brilliant one in Queanbeyan, run by rotary, at the showgrounds, and people did bring their stuff, even bits of meat they'd butchered, bread they'd baked, veggies they'd grown, soap they'd made. And then it got shut down, I have NO idea why. They tried to run a little one near the river, but it just died. Such a market allows the really small operators to sell what they grow or make, and create a market for themselves. There's heaps of people who will prefer to buy at such markets, and talk to the person who grew the food.

My mother grows apples and makes her living selling them direct to people who take the trouble to come out to the farm and buy them. Fact is, in recent years, we could easily sell twice as many as what we've got, demand is through the roof.

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